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This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.

Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.

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naraburns nihil supernum 3d ago (text post) 2585 thread views

Quality Contributions Report for November 2024

This is the Quality Contributions Roundup. It showcases interesting and well-written comments and posts from the period covered. If you want to get an idea of what this community is about or how we want you to participate, look no further (except the rules maybe--those might be important too).

As a reminder, you can nominate Quality Contributions by hitting the report button and selecting the "Actually A Quality Contribution!" option. Additionally, links to all of the roundups can be found in the wiki of /r/theThread which can be found here. For a list of other great community content, see here.

These are mostly chronologically ordered, but I have in some cases tried to cluster comments by topic so if there is something you are looking for (or trying to avoid), this might be helpful.

Quality Contributions to the Main Motte

"I mean, short version, Trump's a lib--at least by the standards of the US culture war circa 1990."

@DiscourseMagnus:

"Personally, the Republicans have lost a lot of goodwill from me by acting like the pro-life mission was accomplished with the end of Roe."

Why did people stop doing covers?

"The problem is that a lot of the data he relies on is bad. A lot of the polling industry is still wrong."

"Insanity: mental health treatment in my corner of America"

"In another interesting development in a week with a number of interesting developments, the Syrian civil war has kicked back up a bit with a surprise rebel offensive that has taken Aleppo..."

Contributions for the week of October 28, 2024

American Needs a Trump

"I think this is why Trump actually has a lot of cross-cultural appeal, because it's the educated Westerners who are strange."

"Trump at least comes across as the guy who actually understands baseball instead of baseball statistics."

"You cannot have it both ways, where on one hand it is just some stupid problem, while at the same time it is a problem that requires probably dozens of people investigating it. So which one is it?"

Contributions for the week of November 4, 2024

"Have we talked about the squirrel? Sigh. Let's talk about the squirrel..."

"In short, the fear of all the Western players is nuclear escalation."

"That's not to say that men can't engage in very positive, productive conversations with a lot of affection -- or that women can't be openly insulting."

"Conversely, inter-male jokes about being the victim of male-on-male sexual violence are pretty common."

Contributions for the week of November 11, 2024

@Hoffmeister25:

"I joined Bluesky yesterday out of curiosity."

"While going full 'vaccines are bad and unecessary' is stupid the pro establishment fanatical close minded position is also stupid and there are valid issues animating RFK and others."

"Horseshoe theory strikes again: Feminists and manospherians agree, the primary worth of women is sex and child-bearing."

"There seem to be a lot of women, of the making histrionic remarks on Facebook variety, who are into looking at the faults of their mothers, and 're-parenting' themselves at 35."

Contributions for the week of November 18, 2024

"A lot of people support Trump because they want to fight back against a system they perceive to be deeply pernicious and entirely insulated from accountability."

@coffee_enjoyer:

"Anyway, an Essene-origin theory of Christianity would explain why they critiqued the Pharisees and scribes, while elevating the status of the poor and ignorant."

Steelmanning Biden's approach on Ukraine.

"Again, there could be benefits to moving to a more "open source" shipbuilding model, but there would also be plenty of challenges, and I don't think it's clear how the scales would tip until we start hammering out the details."

@DirtyWaterHotDog:

"JCPOA withdrawl would have been a slam dunk, but geopolitical changes outside the middle east ruined it."

Dude (Looks Like a Lady)

"So anyway, next time you see some dude in a dress, with long hair and breasts but a face and voice obviously male despite his best efforts, think about what kind of emotions must have driven him to that place, and have a little empathy."

@Primaprimaprima:

"What I find most obnoxious about the contemporary transsexual 'movement' is that they have legislated, by social fiat, a prescribed position on a philosophical question that rightly should be a matter of free inquiry and debate..."

@OliveTapenade:

"If you want me to change my beliefs, you have to actually convince me that my beliefs are false. There is no shortcut."

"If I'd been born ten or even five years later, dollars to donuts I'd be calling myself Lilith right now."

"However 'be nice' cannot possibly mean 'always affirm that what others are doing is good for them and/or for society.'

"I mean I resent that I can't say 'Why yet another Pride event?' I mean I resent knowing that they expect us all to pretend and affirm and validate."

"If it were about the dude in a dress and his particular emotions, it'd be so nice little summer problem."

Contributions for the week of November 25, 2024

"The Matt Gaetz Story: Blackmail Operation, Distraction Attempt, or A Bunch of Convenient Coincidences involving a Naughty Congressman?"

@magic9mushroom:

"Let's assume you're a game dev and you want to make an anti-SJ game."

@SerialStateLineXer:

"So if you're trying to promote hatred of the rich and build a consensus for more redistribution, obviously you want to talk about wealth, and not consumption, so that's what we get."

@Primaprimaprima:

"If you always know the answer in advance, then you're not actually engaged in critical inquiry; you're just grandstanding."

"'We increased the number of students tenfold, but this did not change quality or composition or culture' is just not a very credible claim."

"Reform is a far better option than repeal. But the Jones Act is a meme and virtually all discussion of it is unproductive signaling."

"Foucault and Derrida were popular in their circles but ultimately benign until Americans took them seriously."

"The justice system is too harsh toward people with a life while not being effective at keeping people who can't function of the street."

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Muninn 3d ago

Wow, I want to thank everyone for awarding me an AACQ! I figured if anyone would appreciate a long-winded, repetitive, and self-indulgent peek into a typical bureaucratic/Molochian death spiral it would be my fellow Mottizens and it's heartening to see that it was so. I hope to write and contribute more in the future when my personal life isn't quite so demanding.

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Context

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.

Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.

New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!

Rules

Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats

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