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This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.

Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.

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naraburns nihil supernum 19d ago (text post) Edited 19d ago 4584 thread views

Quality Contributions Report for October 2024

This is the Quality Contributions Roundup. It showcases interesting and well-written comments and posts from the period covered. If you want to get an idea of what this community is about or how we want you to participate, look no further (except the rules maybe--those might be important too).

As a reminder, you can nominate Quality Contributions by hitting the report button and selecting the "Actually A Quality Contribution!" option. Additionally, links to all of the roundups can be found in the wiki of /r/theThread which can be found here. For a list of other great community content, see here.

These are mostly chronologically ordered, but I have in some cases tried to cluster comments by topic so if there is something you are looking for (or trying to avoid), this might be helpful.

Quality Contributions to the Main Motte

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

"So this also explains why marriage often looks so outdated and pointless nowadays; It literally is, at least the way it is treated by the state."

"What I find interesting is how a lot of the new morality is direct subversion of traditional virtues and promoting related sins instead."

"I worked as a title attorney for a decade. It's not a scam."

Contributions for the week of September 30, 2024

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

"So Iran decided to become Hezbollah's sugar daddy."

@100ProofTollBooth:

"Government is incredibly powerful. It's like a mountain. If a mountain shifts in massive ways haphazardly, we call it an earthquake and it's bad."

@P-Necromancer:

"Unions are government-backed cartels. That's not, like, an insult, it's just factually what they are."

@FiveHourMarathon:

"What does an Alabama Sorority Sister Consider an Ordered Sexuality?"

"The reason Aces don't take Psychic type damage is because they're Dark type, and while Dark types might not take Psychic damage they're not immune to status effects [like 'disease' or 'pregnant']."

How is airspace usually regulated?

Contributions for the week of October 7, 2024

"You guys need to organize your elections better. The reason people will believe Trump when he yells 'fraud', is because election fraud looks to be plausible."

"Appearing to turn a blind eye to one's own partisan faction and what they do against their political opponents is about the worst thing you can do for the legitimacy of a legal institution."

"Serious question: is there anything the government could feasibly do now, to nudge Democrats towards accepting the result of the election in the event that Kamala loses?"

"The average Republican, even really conservative Republicans, will fold if accused of sexism or racism and mumble something about how unfair such accusations are. Trump doesn't care!"

"Trump is the first modern politician to truly realize the power of fandoms."

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

[null]

Contributions for the week of October 14, 2024

@CrispyFriedBarnacles:

"I've noted before that I often get a 'born on third, thought they hit a triple' vibe from progressives when it comes to the institutions they've inherited..."

"No, seriously, you can probably pick whatever ideologically-motivated starting point fits your narrative, but it didn't used to be like this."

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@OliveTapenade:

"Today is the one year anniversary of Australia’s Voice to Parliament referendum."

"A Dyslogy for Ireland's 'Hate Speech' Bill"

"You may feel this is brilliant journalism, but nothing in it really addresses child soldiers, which have a sordid history in islamic extremism even without touching on Hamas' deathcult tendencies."

"I'm not shocked Starlink got cut out, they threaten to end someone else's corrupt grift. I can draw no other conclusion."

Contributions for the week of October 21, 2024

@FiveHourMarathon:

"I don't think PMC Turbolibs disdain McDonald's because it is lower class, I think they disdain McDonald's because it is so American."

"It is petty and mean and beneath me. It is my coping mechanism, because this election sucks."

"'The state will shepherd your kid through the psychological turmoil of puberty without your involvement' is a bone-chilling statement."

"I dispute that the regard other world leaders hold the POTUS reflects American standing, and think you are falling victim to the classic conflation of being popular with being influential while tethering yourself to a stunted view of who the audience that matters is."

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

"Most of the K-12 stuff is state level with recommendations from DoE with few hard requirements."

"A lot of hobby spaces have actually banned AI art, and if it's not banned, it's treated with extreme disdain."

"Because the most important thing you need to know about India is the huge inferiority complex the Indian identity has."

"Imagine you are a trauma surgeon."

"What many posters in this forum think AI may imply in the medium to long term in terms of major upheaval and disruption, I view drones implying in the short and medium term."

Contributions for the week of October 28, 2024

"But you know where you really can make a political impact, is showing up to the open sessions of your local school-board, your town-hall meetings, your county supervisors meetings, having read up on the agenda in advance and then taking that opportunity to give your 3-minute speech."

"Scott Alexander endorses basically anyone but Trump"

"Everyone should vote (or not vote!) as seems best to them, without regard for 'picking a winner.'"

"This isn't to say that Republicans don't have use power, or don't use power in ways that I don't like, but it is to say that I will absolutely stand on the belief that Democrats want to exercise control over many, many more aspects of my life than Republicans."

"The social cohesion you see right now, where cities are haunted by the specter of nation-wide race riots and federal politicians are dodging assassins' bullets, this is as good as it's ever going to be, and it's never going to be this good again."

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@Primaprimaprima:

"Essentially I think that the artistic value of pornography lies in treating it as a species of horror."

"Interesting post, but I am reminded of how revolting and deleterious I find continental philosophy."

"If I were a California resident, and my city left me dissatisfied, I would probably vote for Prop 36 just to send a signal to officials."

Gattsuru Specifically Wrote This Because It Wasn't About the Presidential Election or National Politics, But Could See It Being Read Through That Lens

"I'm writing about them -- I'm reading about them -- because people want each and every one from the other team removed.

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RenOS Real libertarians LIKE being outsourced 16d ago

In theory that is possible, but in practice it's imo almost always an attempt to smuggle in the vibes and assumptions you prefer.

5

Context

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.

Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.

New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!

Rules

Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats

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