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Quality Contributions Report for October 2024

This is the Quality Contributions Roundup. It showcases interesting and well-written comments and posts from the period covered. If you want to get an idea of what this community is about or how we want you to participate, look no further (except the rules maybe--those might be important too).

As a reminder, you can nominate Quality Contributions by hitting the report button and selecting the "Actually A Quality Contribution!" option. Additionally, links to all of the roundups can be found in the wiki of /r/theThread which can be found here. For a list of other great community content, see here.

These are mostly chronologically ordered, but I have in some cases tried to cluster comments by topic so if there is something you are looking for (or trying to avoid), this might be helpful.


Quality Contributions to the Main Motte

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@RenOS:

@georgioz:

@Rov_Scam:

Contributions for the week of September 30, 2024

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@Rov_Scam:

@100ProofTollBooth:

@P-Necromancer:

@FiveHourMarathon:

@ThisIsSin:

@gattsuru:

Contributions for the week of October 7, 2024

@marinuso:

@Dean:

@naraburns:

@Amadan:

@GaBeRockKing:

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

[null]

Contributions for the week of October 14, 2024

@CrispyFriedBarnacles:

@Amadan:

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@OliveTapenade:

@Folamh3:

@Dean:

@WhiningCoil:

Contributions for the week of October 21, 2024

@FiveHourMarathon:

@Amadan:

@faceh:

@Dean:

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@TheFooder:

@Amadan

@fauji:

@Throwaway05:

@Dean:

Contributions for the week of October 28, 2024

@hooser:

@Rov_Scam:

@cjet79:

@naraburns:

@Walterodim:

@FCfromSSC:

Plausibly Concerning Something Other Than Trump v. Clinton Biden Harris

@Primaprimaprima:

@4bpp:

@wemptronics:

Gattsuru Specifically Wrote This Because It Wasn't About the Presidential Election or National Politics, But Could See It Being Read Through That Lens

@gattsuru:

11
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I know it's orthogonal, but that NYT piece is pretty thorough. Let me yap about it.

The NYT piece ultimately doesn't really investigate the why schools are mandating enrollment-- and why those schools are often majority minority. It kinda does the journalist thing and quietly alludes to Big Army being behind it, but doesn't provide any evidence for this.

From experience, lots of admin and parental decisions send troublemakers into JROTC with the mistaken belief it will straighten them out. Which I guess is how a school decides to make a program 100% mandatory. Almost universally, troublemakers figure out that JROTC instructors have the same authority and tools as a teacher. Whose authority they have already beaten or frustrated. Some instructors have more talent at discipline having had more practice, but a 100% mandatory enrollment program must be a nightmare. Miserable for any kids with a genuine interest.

Except for a few the program is already perceived by the kids as geeky and uncool enough as is. For those who actually want to be there and those who enjoy it, but won't say as much, it's demoralizing and embarrassing. (There are inter-school events & competitions to be embarrassed at.)

For school admins that have run out of ideas applying the "straighten them out" theory of the unwilling at scale makes sense. So, less about recruitment. I would be interested to see if the mandated JROTC participation has any effect on discipline. I would suspect not. There are definitely some success stories. Some kids do get straightened out or distracted enough to graduate -- enlisting or not. Maybe they would have done the same learning to play an instrument, but the structure does provide some different things than marching band.

“I have issues with behavior, and issues with grooming requirements and other things,” Colonel Anderson said. He said he struggled constantly to maintain a structured class “for teenagers who don’t want to be in the program.”

A lot of kids that never encounter concepts found in a JROTC program in a more positive light: discipline, self-respect, pride, accountability and so on outside of their urban contexts. Many have a warped view on what respect actually means. Traveling and outdoorsing for kids that had never left the city, or never stepped foot into a forest before.

A good program will offer volunteer opportunities and college admissions bait. Even if you've not an interest in going to an academy/ROTC or enlisting it's a plus for admissions. Giving teens an opportunity to manage large budgets, plan and coordinate trips involving 50+ kids across the country, and possibly fuck it up to learn a lesson is generally good. Active duty folks encountered on trips, mostly enlisted, tend to do a decent job counter-weighting any idealized versions of military life.

Recruiters are never going to be hard to find. You want to volunteer to take the ASVAB? That's gonna be a clear opportunity at least once a year. It's fucking obviously used as a recruitment pipeline. However, for a lot of kids and their families enlistment is seen as an increase in station and a direct path out of the hood. Some moms don't like they babies wearing a uniform, but many others insist that they do. I think it's trivially true that, for a lot of kids at the dysfunctional schools from dysfunctional homes, some years of active duty service are probably their easiest, most direct path to a more stable, functional life. Plenty of them enlist, remain fuck ups, and make the military more frustrating for those around them. Oh well.

Maybe a PIJ camp is the same thing, but it looks pretty different from my experience. JROTC camps are more like "Leadership Course Summer Camp." PIJ camp does look like more fun than the actual military for the most part. They all have that in common I imagine. I don't know anything about the America/Israel, Fuck Yeah, Patriotism Camp. That may be closer to PIJ camp than a huge national program like JROTC. Which has expended a fair amount of effort justifying itself, so it's seen as not-just-a-recruitment pipeline, while remaining a recruitment pipeline.

Except for a few the program is already perceived by the kids as geeky and uncool enough as is. For those who actually want to be there and those who enjoy it, but won't say as much, it's demoralizing and embarrassing. (There are inter-school events & competitions to be embarrassed at.)

Sounds like there's a story there. What sort of competitions embarrassed you?

Meh, nothing very exciting.

Different programs vary, but many have some form of regional directors that do annual inspections. The Big Unit Inspection. The director brings some folks from a nearby honor guard to help inspect. That's meant to be impressive, but it's only impressive to the interested. Form up, do some drill, uniform inspection, grooming standards, basic knowledge, and so on. Some poor kid that didn't listen locks their legs and passes out-- doesn't crack their head on the way down, thankfully.

Gigs then compared against your school's history and the rest of the region. The student leadership is meant to be somewhat responsible for this performance. The director is serious about stuff. That's his entire job at this point, but of course his inspectors are mostly having fun spending a day talking shit with youth, telling them to shine their shoes better, re-measure this re-remeasure that holding back a half-smile on their face. Bring the parents out. There's my little sweetie!

Attention to detail and yadda yadda. If a program is filled with the unwilling, then the soft bigotry of low expectations is communicated well enough. "Do better next year!" doesn't get stated anymore. When the guest Muhreen drill instructor judge at exhibition whatever -- meant to be a man you impress -- takes you aside and, rather than give a point-by-point breakdown of stuff that went wrong like he did for everyone else, says, "That was... tough. I think it was good you got them to reform." That hurts the 16 year old autist.

If you're a part an underachieving and particularly shit team, not something intentional like Softball and A Keg on Shitface Saturday, while all the other nearby (suburban) teams appeared to be filled with motivated individuals, not dragged by their heels, and playing to win. That's demoralizing and embarrassing in the context.