site banner
PaperclipPerfector  1mo ago (text post)   36912 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of July 22, 2024

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

7
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

I think that "some ads got through ublock" is not really sufficient evidence for the claim that Google is trying to help Harris here. Google has been quite vocal about their disdain for ad blocking, and their attempts to get around it, for a long time now. Occam's razor suggests that without further evidence, it's probably just that the timing of their latest attempts to get around ad blockers happens to line up with the election campaigning.

If I were going to debut a new advance in ad blocking workarounds I'd probably try and debut it a month or two before the election in order to maximally benefit from the proverbial firehoses of money that are going to be coursing through, personally.

unblockable ads will be a firehose level revenue surge either way, imagine being in sales for google adsense and being able to pitch your product as one of the only unblockable ad spaces on the internet, its gonna print money

I always thought being in sales for Google would be easymode but I’ve since met a number of people who’ve said it’s pretty miserable even relative to the rest of that field.

Unless, of course, your users leave because they are sick of the ads.

I'm not sure there really is a viable alternative currently. Youtube marketshare as a "Media Players And Streaming Platforms category" is at 97.67%. If you look at streaming or short form videos there are competitors, but for long form videos there still isn't any real competition. YouTube rolled out a horrendous UI update but rather than quitting I just found some solutions online via some uBlock filters and Tampermonkey scripts to mostly revert it back to an older UI. I don't know where else I would view videos!

Personally, I would never live without AdBlock, but most people actually don't even bother.

According to one source, 32.8% of people globally use some kind of AdBlock.

Some more stats for US users:

  • "While up to 41% of American internet users report using ad blockers... Ad blocking is detected in 18% of web sessions on computers among American users."
  • 37% of respondents blocked ads while using a desktop computer.
  • 15% of respondents said that they used blockers on mobile devices.
  • 10% of internet users in the US say that they block ads while browsing on a tablet.

One could consider how much time people that use AdBlock spend online relative to those that don't, but I've met plenty of people that spend hours on their phone, and they don't use any form of AdBlock.

Granted he's not quite there yet, but I think this is an overarching goal for Elon with Twitter -- which does seem achievable if YT becomes sufficiently unfriendly. (although it remains to be seen how he would monetize it without resorting to ads himself -- or further strongarming on paid subscriptions I guess)

They won't be shedding many tears if it's the portion of the user base who would be using ad block anyway.

And assuming that it works consistently and can't be countered by an adblock adaptment.

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats