This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Absolutely disgusting. The people peddling the more extremist rhetoric about Trump should be ashamed. On the bright side, perhaps those people will shut up for a while and we can regain some level of sanity for at least a little while.
As (nearly) always happens, I expect the actual outcome here to be the complete opposite of the shooter's goals and Trump just won the election by a landslide.
Most of the commentary I'm seeing elsewhere is of the "we came so close to a better world today" variety. (Quote, not paraphrase.)
Of course, I follow people who are fairly left of typical here. But the overlap between that and the more extreme rhetoric is significant enough.
More options
Context Copy link
It really doesn't look like the usual suspects understand that shutting up would be prudent. I think their social media instincts are very poorly calibrated for such extreme events.
Some highly liked reactions:
https://x.com/davidhogg111/status/1812320926240764072
https://x.com/GeorgeTakei/status/1812290878167281860
https://x.com/keithedwards/status/1812284437092307015
Reddit is linked below, you can get a load of what's happening there.
I am no Trump fan as you perhaps remember. He is graceless. But gracelessness is the default today, and it's very easy to stoop lower than a man who has just survived an assassination attempt – with these cringeworthy, mother hen attempts at narrative control.
With that said, apparently the Biden campaign itself was very quick to pull all of its ads attacking trump.
More options
Context Copy link
The lack of self-awareness in that george takei tweet is so galling I almost think it's a joke. You can't claim your tribe is calling for unity while in the same tweet stoking division.
Since I've seen his public statements Takei has always been utterly full of himself. (So was Sulu, so maybe he wasn't acting)
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Confusing. Does he think that kids are getting shot to death in schools every day?
I am guessing he means at home or in general
'don't survive' makes it hard to take that interpretation.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Technically by the rules used to track school shootings, they are. Any shooting within X-feet (300?) of a school, at any time of day or night regardless of if the school was in session.
Naturally this lumps in a lot of common urban shootings stemming from 2AM drug deals gone bad.
Does it also include bullets fired by police officers?
I believe so but haven't confirmed. Blip on the chart regardless.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Kids aren't usually shot in drug deals gone bad. I remain skeptical.
16-19 year olds are also "kids" if you look at the statistics, and also near the peak demo for gang shootings. It's procedural manipulation all the way down
This has always annoyed me. I know a few people even IRL who say with a straight face they are afraid to send their kids to school because of not just gun violence but mass shootings specifically. I'm incredulous. First because it remains rare enough that reacting to it, especially in an area as important as basic childhood education, is illogical. It's like developing agoraphobia from lightning strikes, as a lazy example. There are some fears that are unhelpful. Second, by legitimizing this fear, we actually propagate it. Kids are especially sensitive to these kinds of signals from adults, and may go on to develop real, illogical, and damaging fears and phobias based on their legitimization. Which is extra frustrating because some on the left seem at least aware of this on some level, because we are pretty sure that the way the media treats mass shootings is a self-fulfilling prophesy because of the increased number of copy-cat shooters.
More options
Context Copy link
According to the Washington Post there have been 413 school shootings since 1999.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/interactive/school-shootings-database/
I would expect that the Post would use the broadest feasible definition. I'm calling this one thoroughly deboonked - it's a regard on twitter, trying to rationalize a non-existent statistic is a waste of time.
No, the Washington Post is actually the most reasonable and conservative school shootings database. It's the one we always point to when the rest of the press use absurd numbers like "over 500 this year!!!"
Jesus Christ this is unpleasant.
Here's CNN quoting 34 school shootings this year.
https://www.cnn.com/us/school-shootings-fast-facts-dg/index.html
Obviously we are more than 34 school days into the year.
I have not seen any statistic even close to one school shooting per day. It is pretty strange to insist repeatedly that this statistic exists without evidence - just link it if it's so obvious.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link