naraburns nihil supernum
1yr ago
(text post)
29413 thread views
Israel-Gaza Megathread #1
This is a megathread for any posts on the conflict between (so far, and so far as I know) Hamas and the Israeli government, as well as related geopolitics. Culture War thread rules apply.
Israel signed the Chemical Weapons Convention but refused to ratify it and as best I know is not bound by it. They are free to gas their enemies, despite the obvious optics issue.
While tunnels are probably a best case scenario for using poison gas, Israel probably doesn’t have chemical weapons stockpiled in the necessary quantities or the ability to rapidly fabricate it in the amounts necessary. Remember clearing a tunnel system that way entails dumping tons and tons(a gas grenade or three won’t cut it) of sarin or vx or mustard gas down ventilation shafts, which has to be deployable in a war zone in a way that’s safe for the operator. They might be able to use it to clear a limited branch of the tunnels, but Hamas has probably stockpiled gas masks even if they don’t have enough for everyone, so you’re not taking them out in one fell swoop and they can still defend localized areas.
Why would they bother violating treaties on chemical weapons when incendiaries will work as well and can't be defeated with gas masks or even self-contained oxygen?
Well yeah, that’s my point- chemical weapons aren’t enough of a war-winning weapon compared to the alternatives for Israel to bother violating treaties over.
This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a
court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to
optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.
The weekly Culture War threads host the most
controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are
appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy;
if in doubt, post!
Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts.
You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.
Why are you called The Motte?
A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently,
it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey",
originally identified by
philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial
but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens
this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for
the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired
propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."
On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.
New post guidelines
If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it.
A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts
such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a
submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).
Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or
significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Israel signed the Chemical Weapons Convention but refused to ratify it and as best I know is not bound by it. They are free to gas their enemies, despite the obvious optics issue.
I'm sure the irony is apparent to all.
While tunnels are probably a best case scenario for using poison gas, Israel probably doesn’t have chemical weapons stockpiled in the necessary quantities or the ability to rapidly fabricate it in the amounts necessary. Remember clearing a tunnel system that way entails dumping tons and tons(a gas grenade or three won’t cut it) of sarin or vx or mustard gas down ventilation shafts, which has to be deployable in a war zone in a way that’s safe for the operator. They might be able to use it to clear a limited branch of the tunnels, but Hamas has probably stockpiled gas masks even if they don’t have enough for everyone, so you’re not taking them out in one fell swoop and they can still defend localized areas.
Why would they bother violating treaties on chemical weapons when incendiaries will work as well and can't be defeated with gas masks or even self-contained oxygen?
Well yeah, that’s my point- chemical weapons aren’t enough of a war-winning weapon compared to the alternatives for Israel to bother violating treaties over.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Given how over gassed the Tavors and Galils are, they're not above gassing themselves either. /s
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link