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PaperclipPerfector  1yr ago (text post)   2866 thread views

Friday Fun Thread for September 22, 2023

Be advised: this thread is not for serious in-depth discussion of weighty topics (we have a link for that), this thread is not for anything Culture War related. This thread is for Fun. You got jokes? Share 'em. You got silly questions? Ask 'em.

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I don’t think that’s right. Gambling has been a problem in every culture where it was permitted. If it is available it will trap men, as it did to important men of history like Tesla and Mozart. It’s a superstimuli, So it will be inherently addictive regardless of what is going on in a culture. Video games are a hyper-extension of gambling, involving all the same cognition but with added superstimuli.

Porn, like gambling, is also a superstimuli. No matter how healthy your culture is, superstimuli activity will always be more desirable by definition. It doesn’t matter how hot your wife is if you can see a variety of the world’s most attractive women by clicking a few buttons.

I would say these things are definitively in the category of “causes”, just like the availability of opiates and alcohol are also causes. If every human had the ability to click a button and be administered an opiate, probably half the world would be addicted, because human nature involves occasional lapses in judgment and willpower.

It’s a bit odd how gambling is hardly mentioned in the Bible. Was the addictive technology that makes it so dangerous not invented yet?

I think gambling preys on what makes people successful in more modern societies.

When people get into trouble it's often best to ignore negative setbacks, focus on the positive, knuckle down and work hard.

In more primitive societies people are at the mercy of the elements. If you're a peasant and there's a major crop failure right before winter, working hard won't make anything better. Starvation is coming and you just have to curl up and endure until spring.

Invasions are similar, hide until the problem goes away.

That is odd.

I wonder when gambling really gains traction in the West. Wikipedia is pretty barren. You’ve got 5,000-year-old dice from the Middle East, then nothing until the Renaissance. Except further down it says that Aquinas and friends were debating the subject.

Ah, here we go. The Romans were, of course, really into gambling.

Maybe it’s an urban thing. The biggest cities, and the most developed economies, were the ones which saw gambling as a larger phenomenon?

The conflict in the Mahabarata, which could be loosely described as a Hindu holy book, is instigated when the evil uncle and cousin lure the emperor into a dice game with weighted dice. The way it's described (at least in the translation I've read) paints the emperor as fairly blame-free as he bets successively more and more on the dice game trying to chase his losses to the point where he loses his kingdom. The responsibility lies chiefly with the uncle and cousin who made the gambling available.

That’s interesting. I did some googling and don’t see a lot of mentions of gambling from Ancient Israel. It would be a sin by consequence though, falling under foolishness / love of money

With gambling I think back to when I was a kid, and it was perfectly possible for a middle class American to gamble any time they wanted, you just had to take a trip to Atlantic City, Vegas, or one of the Indian reservations. Because it was in a designated area, and most people need to take an overnight trip to get there, there was a romance and occasion to it.

There's something miserable about video poker machines in gas stations that I just can't get behind. About windowless off track betting parlors. And gambling on your phone removes all the positives you might be paying for at a casino: the atmosphere, the occasion, the trip, the social conviviality and adventure. It replaces it all with the bare fact of pissing money away.

And maybe I'm just glorifying my childhood, addicts still fucked things up, but it seems like we had a good compromise and fucked it up.

A funny modern development is gambling streamers. Twitch, the incumbent in streaming, banned gambling a while ago, but it draws enough users to gambling that Stake, an online gambling company, funded an entire twitch competitor - Kick - just to bring back gambling streams. They also pay popular streamers to gamble on kick. The streams themselves are apparently entertaining enough to draw tens of thousands of viewers per stream, which is comparable to e.g. many millions of youtube views. To me, it's strange - you're just sitting there as slots, tiles stream by and sometimes match up, and someone else's finances do a random walk. (While the losses the streamer makes are real in one sense, it's more than compensated for by their pay). And the streamer isn't even pulling a 'lever' with their finger, it's fully automated. (As this vod demonstrates - letters and colors fall for a full hour next to an empty chair). I understand the appeal of watching the talented play sports and esports. I understand the thrill of gambling. But when you've taken out both the skill and the risk, what's even left?

I found a few years ago that I enjoy watching gacha pull streams and videos on Twitch and YouTube, much to my surprise. Gacha pulls being video game slot machines where in-game currency (purchasable with real currency, of course) is exchanged for a chance at acquiring an in-game character or item. I had expected to have no interest given the purely random nature of it, but that was not my experience at all.

One big thing I noticed was that there was a lot of fun in the vicarious thrill of both the high highs and the low lows. IRL and in video games, I hate gambling. The last time I went to a casino, I stuck to the $1 tables, and I don't spend money for pulls in gacha games. The streamers and YouTubers whose pull videos I watch tend to be whales who regularly spend $hundreds in a sitting just for a chance at getting some video game characters (and sometimes just for minor buffs for characters they already have), and it's fun to vicarious experience someone else's thrill of winning big or their despair of an extended losing streak without actually putting my money on the line.

Another big thing is the streamer or YouTuber themselves. Creating reaction content is a skill, and the way these people react to their randomly-generated victories and defeats can be quite entertaining to watch. I imagine these are factors that provide appeal for streams involving actual gambling.

But when you've taken out both the skill and the risk, what's even left?

Distraction? Sort of association with money?

100% There's a already lot of good evidence already backing the idea that gambling in a convenience store, or even worse, on a phone, is uniquely addicting in a way destination gambling is not. I actually turned down a job with DraftKings earlier this year because I think their business model is hugely predatory.

No I agree, unfortunately it became an arms race between the states and municipalities for tax revenue until most restrictions on gambling location were removed.

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