This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
This is less surprising than you think. 20 years ago is 2004. Dick Cheney's daughter was already a lesbian (and gay politics was clearly rising) and Democrats were solidifying as the anti-Iraq party (notably Afghanistan was not demonized, not the insertion of ourselves into the Houthi conflict), had repudiated the Clinton welfare reforms, and had Obama as the star speaker at their convention. We were on a trajectory to one party clearly being against your average white guy, and the other winning most white guys. If anything, unions have been slow to embrace the fact that Democrats largely have assembled a coalition that rejects being a normal working person.
And then, of course, there is the gay stuff.
This is ancient history, but I seem to recall her being thrown under the bus by her father and sister. This doesn't make it "less surprising" for me, the progressive reverence for the Cheney family is whiplash inducing.
More options
Context Copy link
The Democrats heel turn to becoming the pro-war party is still surprising, right?
Obama was still pro-Afghanistan when he gave the convention speech and during both 2008 and 2012 campaigns. Their opposition to war has always been more who/whom than the romantics seem to think. Clinton was happily intervening in Bosnia and Rwanda.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link