This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Conservatives don't have a solution to low TFR because Christianity, the European fertility cult for many hundreds of years at this point, is waning.
You know who has a fertility cult? The Jewish sects in Israel which have staggering TFR. Those sects have other problems, too, but it's proof positive for how our religious impulse directs our breeding behavior.
We need a post-postmodern, non-Abrahamic fertility cult, specifically one that esoterically targets, not just higher TFR in general, but a eugenic mate selection. Higher TFR for only high-quality people. Conservatives can't provide that.
Damn, you just can't not talk about Jews for very long, can you?
Mormons and Amish and Muslims are pretty fecund too. So, for that matter, are Africans, mostly not followers of Abrahamic religions.
I think it's more complicated than "fertility cults" but sure, good luck with your eugenics program.
Fertility has always been associated with a collective religion, and collective religion is a eugenics program. Judaism is a eugenics program. This is the result of a eugenics program and a demonstration of the world-shaping power of Religion as an esoteric eugenics program.
We are living in the only time in which fertility is not heavily associated with a collective religion, and it's also the time in which TFR is collapsing. And the collapse falls along the lines of religiosity, with Christian families having substantially higher TFRs than atheists. It is not at all an oversimplification to relate reproductive behavior to Religion. Mormons, Amish, Muslims, Jews, Christians are all examples of this. Atheists are an example of this, too, by way of breeding themselves out of existence.
More options
Context Copy link
Huh? 93% of Sub-Saharan Africans self-identify as either Christian or Muslim.
Huh, didn't realize Islam had permeated the continent that thoroughly.
I mean, even if you turned every single one of those Muslims back into African Pagans, you’d still have 63% of Africans identifying as Christians, and your claim would still be wildly wrong.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link