site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of May 20, 2024

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

8
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Do we need the physicians to know the Latin for every small part of the body?

Yes, physicians need to know what parts of the body are called. That these terms are usually Latin has no bearing on that.

More or less, yes. Despite my position above that I don't think of there being much of a crisis of competence in medicine, that's precisely because there are standards that everyone has to meet. Some professions are basically fake in terms of actual technical knowledge and people can get by with a combination of improvisation and charisma; my impression is that people in these jobs sometimes mistakenly believe that all jobs work that way, and it just ain't so. Things like medicine and engineering have irreducible complexity, where you actually have to know each part of it and be able to use that understanding in practice. Physicians require more actual knowledge than marketing executives.

We need physicians to know the proper technical term for each small part of the body so they can talk to other physicians about it quickly and precisely. "Fracture of the left thumb" is not acceptable medical writing because the orthopaedic surgeon who reads it now has to find the X-ray image to know which bone in the thumb is fractured.

You can argue that Latinate technical terms make medicine harder to learn than strictly necessary, but the alternative of using technical terms that sound like ordinary words is worse (I've taught physics, I have the scars). In any case, my experience of dealing with doctors is that the technical terms named after obscure 19th century surgeons are more confusing that the Latinate ones.

I kind of want to see Ander-Saxon for medicine.

This is liefsome, but how would we win over the leeches to eft learn all their leechcraft anew?

The latin is the proxy for competence. If the doctor can't keep up with their research and papers to know their specialized lingo then they're unlikely to understand the workings of their trade. When you're in a select high context community, language is the filter to weed out imposters.