This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I agree that this a criticism of Christianity, but I think it applies to virtually every faith except Judaism, because Judaism is uniquely oriented around perceived familial ties and extrajudicial nationhood. Muslims haven’t always defended other Muslims, they have routinely warred against each other. Buddhists didn’t always defend Buddhists. Sikhs would likely defend to such a degree, but again, that’s because it naturally construes itself as its own nation. This is one of the drawbacks of a purely spiritual religion that isn’t concerned with genetic ties.
I have a different thought. I think it’s because people have misunderstood “turn the other cheek” to mean “be a doormat”. There were plenty of times in Christian history in which Christians would have absolutely gone to war to defend themselves or other Christians. I see it as us being victims of our own success — we haven’t (at least in Europe) been persecuted seriously in the last 500 years, so we have adopted a “just be nice” approach that others (particularly the Jews) have been persecuted out of. Jews know what happens when they ignore persecuted Jews.
More options
Context Copy link
This is drawback of being world religion with billions of adherents. If you really tried to "defend" every persecuted Christian everywhere, you would find yourself in perpetual Iraq style quagmires all over the world (which would be rather suboptimal situation even for world's first super power).
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link