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Notes -
This side steps the larger point.
"Empowering feminism" lets women run away with some of their base instincts without consequence. Yes, I'm talking about sex. No, I'm not talking about normie casual sex. I mean the fact that "feminists" say that stripping, OnlyFans, and prostitution are "empowering" for women. This is plain insanity.
Society has taken about 2000 years to get a real handle on policing men's base instincts. If you're a dude who immediately defaults to physical violence on a daily basis to solve your problems, you are not "empowering yourself" you are "entering a plea." You are - and should be - recognized to be an anti-social criminal who can't be trusted in society.
An interesting thing to do is to ask women in your life (friends and families, this isn't flirtatious talk) when they became aware that they had some measure of sexual influence over men. Then answer is going to be around puberty. From that time forward, most women known they could use that power but generally that they ought not to for trivial things or with deceitful intent. Again, most women are smart and morally competent.
The corollary for men is when they became aware that physical violence, or its implication, would be a part of their daily life. Again, the answer is somewhere around puberty. Again again (again?) Most men do not walk around everyday eager to throw down for minor displays of disrespect - but we're aware of it in our heads.
These two domains - sex and physical violence - inform a lot of intersexual dynamics. In the West, the closest thing we have to a societal consensus is "men shouldn't use violence to resolve disputes." There's maybe some folks who want to bring back mutual combat and honor duels, but that's hyper fringe. We do not have anything close to consensus on female sexuality. In fact, a lot of the "discourse" is inherently contradictory, changes rapidly with perspective, context, and circumstance, and is often motivated more by emotional self-preservation than a society first mindset. Hence "feminism is whatever women do" or, more to the point, "feminism is unquestionably supporting anything that women do."
Should we enforce female sexual behavior in the same criminal justice construct as male physical violence? No, because there are some categorical differences; male physical violence can result in immediate loss of life and it is coercive in that it does not take two party consent for it to happen most times. Female sexuality won't kill you right away and, although female-on-male rape does happen, it is nowhere near as frequent and occurs in drastically different circumstances as male-on-female rape. Women who use sex are mostly using it with willing partners. Generally speaking, women who do use sexuality for deceitful and manipulative purposes use it as part of a larger game of deceit and exploitation. Men who use physical violence are mostly engaged in a singular immediate conflict with unambiguous resolution.
And when you can't, or have great difficulty enforcing behaviors in a criminal justice construct, you (that is, society) resorts to cultural and social regulation. The above topline post on University of Alabama sororities does a great job illustrating this. To those girls, to be ostracized by their sorority sisters for being "too provocative" at a party is a fate equivalent to a 4 year prison sentence. Making a value judgement that this sort of voluntary in-group policing is "oppressive" is really just a rejection of that value system overall. You might see it that way, but the participants in it might see it another way, perhaps even beneficial to them ... or their society.
To tie this thing off and get back to the comment I was responding to - "empowering" in the feminism context is meaningless because there is not only no clear criteria for when to use it, it is applied to anything and everything even when self-contradictory. It also, sneakily, reveals that being empowered - which one would presume to mean having power - is the ultimate goal. That's in no way a marxist dialectic right, right?
I think its interesting you draw a parallel between violence and sex. "Women have sexual power over men, and they know it" is the bog-standard water I live in, and if pressed to provide a parallel for men, I'm not sure I would have thought violence. (To be fair, I wasn't given very much time to think about it).
It reminds me of something I posted over on Scott's new blog, although it didn't get much engagement because I do not fit into Scott's comment demographic as much anymore. Reposted for convenience:
Introspecting -- at no point during puberty did I ever become aware of myself as a "violent being" (to appropriate the term "sexual being"), and even today I don't think I've ever used threat of violence as a bargaining chip. I suspect the same is true for the stereotypical incel-type. I think I agree with your taxonomy.
Thanks!
It's definitely "harder" to see because Men, in the west, are taught that violence is almost never appropriate outside of self-defense situations*. There's also the decline of violence adjacent physical work - most pointedly agricultural work. If you're working with various kinds of livestock larger than a chicken, you're going to spend time literally coercing a living thing with your physical will (we don't negotiate with
terroristsheifers!). But that's the kind of thing I meant when gesturing towards men and puberty. It would be odd and bad if most guys came online at 13,14,15 with the thought of "Oh, I can go kick somebody's ass now!" But I still think guys at that age think, "Hmm...I can like, do stuff with my body"More options
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Tangentially, would you say that for a man to train in BJJ, or boxing, or firearms is empowering?
I don't disagree with the various criticisms of feminism and its habitual maneuvering to wriggle out of apportioning some responsiblity for women's choices to women themselves. But the motte of empowerment is simply that these decisions that women make are now made by choice. Being obliged or pressured to take a job, or have kids, or get a divorce, or pose naked isn't empowering. Being allowed the choice to do those things is where the claim of empowerment comes from.
It's not meaningless. It's just that it's only trivially meaningful. Women have been empowered to choose what they do where previously they weren't (or weren't seen/believed to do so). Being empowered to vote doesn't mean you have the same power as the winner of the election, but it's better than having no say at all. The confusion is that empowerment is spoken of as if it were akin to exercising power itself rather than exercising a limited choice. "Girl power!"... to choose between working a hundred hours for one boss or working one hour for a hundred bosses. Either way you're going to work.
Yes. Also working out and becoming fit. A man's brain works better with these things.
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