site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of August 5, 2024

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

8
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

I think it will have an impact in the sense that I think it will eventually backfire once the conventions are over and the median American starts paying attention.

First off all because this is a very basic question of junior high level bullying behavior. They’re calling Vance names on the basis of an obviously false accusation that is supposed to be in his book but isn’t. This isn’t going to endear the Harris ticket to outsiders.

Second, and I’m amazed at the sheer incompetence of the strategic leadership that haven’t screamed about the possibility, is that it opens the door to the GOP pointing out all the progressive weirdness. And to the eyes of normal average Americans, progressives are a lot weirder than conservatives. The party that wants to normalize drag queen story hour for preschoolers is simply not going to win the battle to convince the average 50 year old guy who’s not into politics that the GOP is weirder than they are. Weird is actually the progressive Achilles heel— pointing out deviants just means people realizing just how weird liberals are. If I were running a GOP campaign, I’d lean into it. Yes, we’re “weird. So weird that we don’t want to trans your kid without your permission. So weird that we believe in marriage and family. So weird that we’d rather wave the American flag than the Palestinian flag.

Third, and you point out, it’s a huge distraction from real problems real people are facing. Inflation is lowering the standard of living. There’s one war ongoing in Ukraine and another brewing in the Middle East. We have a housing crisis. Our schools don’t do a good job educating kids and teachers are quitting in droves. Abortion is a big issue. The border. But they aren’t talking about those things, instead, they’re talking about the GOP being weird.

They’re calling Vance names on the basis of an obviously false accusation that is supposed to be in his book but isn’t. This isn’t going to endear the Harris ticket to outsiders.

Oh no, I think you'll find THEY didn't call Vance names (Walz mentioned a couch, just coincidentally I'm sure, but didn't repeat the story.). That (so the story will go) was Internet trolls, probably MAGA people who were upset that Vance beat our their favorite Herr Hitler for the spot.

As far as I know, the story that Lyndon Johnson spread the rumor that his opponent fucked a pig not because he thought people would believe it, but in order to get his opponent to deny it, isn't true. But someone on Kamala's team clearly remembered it.