This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
It's totally a shibboleth. I speak 'redneck English' and can easily understand both Ebonics and standard American English(and can speak either) a bit more easily than the Queen's English and whatever the hell Marianne Williamson speaks(and can't really speak either of those), and understand both of those with less effort than blue collar Hispanic ESOL(where it'd be 50/50 on whether it's easier to switch to Spanish), and understand that a bit more easily than Chinglish, which I in turn find easier to understand than something like Dutch(which I can, haltingly, string together a few sentences in).
Now the signal "I am literate" is a valuable one to exist and we don't have to pretend it isn't. That someone finished society's basic educational expectations is important information, and choosing to share or not share that information is an important contextual signal. A black who speaks Ebonics in a job interview is sending a signal and that signal is 'I'm either uneducated or don't give a shit'.
I was about to ask you a question under the impression that you meant the dialect(s) spoken in Appalachia, and then remembered that you live in Texas, not in my neck of the woods. Rednecks are everywhere!
Anyway I mostly agree with you. Dialectal variation in American English is shockingly small, certainly compared to e.g. the variation in Great Britain. Aside from maybe AA(V)E, which does seem to have some unusual grammatical constructions, pretty much all varieties of American English are easily mutually intelligible if you are willing to try. (For what it's worth, though I grew up in Appalachian Virginia, my parents are highly educated transplants. My brain seems to produce exclusively SAE even though I have no trouble understanding the Appalachian dialect/accent.)
More options
Context Copy link
Southern American English is likely considerably closer to AAVE than Midland or Mid-Atlantic, so no surprise you can understand it better than many other white Americans. And most Southerners seem to code-switch to something less distinctively southern when talking to Northerners.
Yes, in a formal register I speak something closer to SAE than my usual red dirt dialect. "I" instead of "aaah" but I keep the guttural R and the WH sound.
“Guttural R”, as in French or German? Can you give an example word?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiced_velar_approximant#Voiced_velar_bunched_approximant
When I say agree and argue it sounds like I'm saying the standard American English R and a modern Greek gamma or Arabic GH at the same time. It's not a gargle like the Parisians use. Clear sounds like 'klee-a-growl' said by an auctioneer. Raise and red sound a bit closer to the SAE counterparts but rude and rub don't.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link