This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
In no sense does this address any of the criticisms I’ve leveled against your post. Nobody has argued that Leon Czolgosz, anarcho-communist, was not left-wing. The problem is that, again, your original post called him a “Democrat”. That’s what you said. Not whatever you’re now pretending you said instead.
I think it does and that you are taking refuge in pedantics to avoid the plain truth of my statement.
Your statement isn’t true, though! Are you suggesting that John Wilkes Booth was a left-winger? If not, then your attempt to insinuate that all of the presidential assassins were left-wingers plainly fails. (And again, it fails doubly because Charles Guiteau had few if any identifiably “left-wing” beliefs.)
Or, if you want to instead claim, as you originally did, that all of the presidential assassins have been members of the Democratic Party, you are then stuck explaining why Leon Czolgosz had literally zero affiliation with the party and does not seem to have ever voted for them, as well as why Guiteau was not only a registered Republican but also an active campaigner for the Republican presidential candidate, who hoped to receive an appointed position in a Republican administration.
Overall, your post was a disjointed mess full of easily-refutable claims, and your attempts to rescue it have contained even more lies and dodging. There is no identifiable ideological or partisan pattern when it comes to the men who have successfully carried out executions of American presidents, and your attempt to conjure one out of thin air abjectly failed.
I'm flat out saying that he was a Democrat and merely suggesting that he was a left-winger.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link