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PaperclipPerfector  6mo ago (text post)   24831 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of May 6, 2024

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Don't all countries with legal systems based on the English common law have freedom of speech?

In Australia we have 18C. Speech is free so long as you're not racist. Plus we have pretty aggressive anti-defamation laws.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_18C_of_the_Racial_Discrimination_Act_1975

English law doesn't even recognize that concept; the US's notion of protecting it was a reaction to it being non-existent.

Later nations gesture vaguely at the concept, but if it's in their law, it's always explicitly prefaced with "unless we really don't want to".

That's not true. There was a debate in the US over even including the bill of rights because those rights were considered to already exist and it was worried that including it would imply rights not listed did not exist.

In Canada, our Charter of Rights explicitly lists "freedom of expression", but there was also a law passed earlier recognizing an already existing "freedom of speech" and there are court rulings stating that this already existed as a quasi-constitutional right emerging from English common law.

In Canada, our Charter of Rights explicitly lists "freedom of expression"

S. 1 of the CCRF is the explicit "everything after this section is functionally meaningless" part. It's difficult to miss, being at the top and all. And if that wasn't enough, there's S. 33 (which normally gets used for provincial vs. federal slapfights).

and it was worried that including it would imply rights not listed did not exist.

Well, given how they treat the rights that are listed...

What I'm saying is not true is your assertion that the US's notion of protecting freedom of speech was a reaction to it being non-existent.

English law does recognize the concept, since it’s part of the ECHR which is British law. But the ECHR does caveat hate speech, dangerous speech and so on.

But the ECHR does caveat hate speech, dangerous speech and so on

Yes, that's what "no right to free speech" means.

Sure, but that isn’t no understanding of free expression, it’s just a different one. For most of the history of the US states had various laws banning various kinds of speech, so did the federal government during the wars. Absolute free speech is a 20th century interpretation of the first amendment.

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