This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Rust may or may not be the language of the future. Most industries are still firmly in the past. How could they be otherwise? When your engineers each have 30+ years of experience with a language, they’d stick to it even if every new posting demanded Rust. It was hard enough to wean them off Fortran.
Trend-chasing is for the startups. Do you know how many man-hours my coworkers wasted on a bid to start using Docker? I don’t, because at some ambiguous point they pivoted to Kubernetes. I can’t even tell if that panned out, because the whole R+D program got slashed next time a government budget was delayed.
I’m sure there are lean, hungry teams who started a project with Rust in mind. They’ll all put it on their resumes. As it bubbles up into the general consciousness, chief engineers will start floating it as a process improvement. Then PMs will decide to bid stuff with Rust in there. If the customer doesn’t shoot them down, maybe then you get some products depending on Rust. But that takes time.
I was under the impression that Rust was a language that plenty of programmers liked, but that there are few projects using it, leaving the coders stuck with java or whatever.
Of course, java programmers are probably more plentiful for the foreseeable future than rust programmers, so for projects where the dev costs dominate the runtime costs, sticking to java might actually be correct from a management point of view.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link