site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of March 4, 2024

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

6
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

If you work with classified information, sudden spurts of wealth are noticed. It's one of the primary signs discussed in all materials and training. Someone with a clearance suddenly acquiring a lot of money is suspicious. And can be reported without any other evidence, at which point someone will start asking questions. And there are self-reporting requirements for such things. You can't just secretly "come into your inheritance".

This is a limited power when the leaker's coworkers are also constrained by social niceties. But this hypothetical leaker can't just spend wantonly.

Oh I totally get that. I just think people vastly overestimate the security apparatus when it comes to detecting or caring about money and corruption. Report you found a hard drive in your basement...if you haven't screwed up badly nothing will come of it. There are an abnormal amount of rich people in government and intelligence that were not rich when they started.

Bog standard insider trading or non-foreign linked consulting gigs are hard to detect because some people really do beat the market or have consulting gigs.

But if an NSA cryptographer gets a six-figure no show job with a Confucius institute, well…. And it’s not like Russia and China can offer better opportunities for insider trading than they already get.

There are an abnormal amount of rich people in government and intelligence that were not rich when they started.

Are there? How do you know? Are you including elected officials in this group?

The rate of hard corruption (e.g. outright bribery) in the US is not zero, but it’s pretty low.

One reason it’s low is that we have real competition between two major parties who share and switch off power, and always have an incentive to nail the opposing side for violations.

Yes it isn't "hard", it is obvious though. No one is trading bags of cash. They just say buy NVDA options or Here have a 400k seat on the board.