site banner
PaperclipPerfector  9mo ago (text post)   29231 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 19, 2024

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

11
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

there is some overlap between schizophrenia and gender dysphoria.

That study is ridiculous. It seems to have been written specifically to present the single undocumented case study involving the most perfect possible patient to demonstrate a link between schizophrenia and dysphoria, a guy who ramped up attempts to transition only during psychotic breaks. It defines dysphoria, but never defines psychosis. This might be cynical, but it looks to me like two doctors building careers for themselves as experts in psychotic dysphoria based on one guy whose schizophrenia cleared up after 5 visits.

Check it out, the the conclusion reads (emphasis mine):

This case presentation depicts a clear pattern of gender identity change from male to female coinciding solely with psychotic breaks of schizoaffective disorder, bipolar type. The authors postulate that gender dysphoria can co-occur with other psychiatric disorders or as a direct result of acute psychosis. It is important to note the distinction between “gender dysphoria” and “transgender/gender non-binary identity”. As stated above, gender dysphoria occurs when a discrepancy between one’s sex assigned at birth and one’s gender identity causes distress or impairment in function while transgender/gender non-binary identity is an umbrella term for people whose gender identity is different from the sex assigned to them at birth. It is important to note that one can occur without the other and not everyone with gender dysphoria symptoms would benefit from HRT, surgery, or other gender-affirming interventions. On the other hand, many transgender individuals and gender non-binary individuals who do not meet the criteria for gender dysphoria may benefit considerably from gender-affirming treatments. Additionally, the authors consider that it would be noteworthy to study gender variance during the various stages of schizoaffective disorder to better understand if gender dysphoria tends to occur more during periods of psychotic episodes versus mood episodes.

The authors emphasize the critical importance of distinguishing between the two presentations of gender dysphoria (co-occurring with psychiatric disorders or as a direct result of acute psychosis) to ensure an accurate diagnosis before proceeding with treatment for gender concerns. A thorough diagnostic evaluation, physical examination, and the collection of collateral information are all necessary steps in the proper diagnosis and the allocation of treatment planning. Additionally, the patient’s capacity to make decisions should be well-established before proceeding with any plans for treatment. Furthermore, emphasis should be placed on the consideration of each case on an individual basis with unique needs as the field of medicine moves briskly towards recognizing health equity at every level of medical attention

I don't know if it's an invention, but I wouldn't be surprised at all.

This isn't the only study on this topic. Clearly schizophrenia is not the main cause of gender dysphoria, and this may just be a case of everything is correlated.

One of my early hypotheses to explain the use of "male aliases" on her criminal record was that her psychotic episodes involved both crime and dysphoria. It turns out this was doubly incorrect: she didn't use male aliases, and didn't have dysphoria.

I am specifically bitching about that study, it looks like a scam. I'm not disputing the idea that there is a link between dysphoria and schizophrenia, and personally I think it's guaranteed to be stronger than "everything is correlated" (although that is a brilliant piece that everyone should read) because I don't think the scientific community puts in anywhere near enough effort to determine a physical and neurological difference between dysphoria and psychosis.

Which is not to say there is no difference, or that all gid sufferers are in the throes of psychosis, but that a diagnosis of gid precludes the possibility of psychosis on political grounds (namely the stigma attached to it) and the diagnosis is too often applied without any neurological tests whatsoever.

That first study you link here is much better (I don't have time to read the second right now.)

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats