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PaperclipPerfector  11mo ago (text post)   27875 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of November 27, 2023

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"Group loyalty" will do in a pinch, but I like to use the Arabic word, as it's exotic origin allow it to be somewhat more expansive, as non-Arabs can't parse the word. "A group's animating spirit" is what I'd call it, and yeah I know it's pretty vague for a definition. I disagree it's fascistic, unless you believe committing to any group is inherently fascistic. Liberal democracies need asabiyyah too, and in fact witnessing American asabiyayah in action was a bit of a culture shock moment for me, a cynical post-communist Easterner. It's fair enough if you want no part in it, I'm not here to convert you, and I used to be a hardcore individualist myself, so I can imagine where you're coming from, but hopefully the explanation will help you understand where we're coming from as well (and not paint us as reactionary theocratic monarchists).

The highest asabiya societies (tribal, nomadic, clannish) are not places I want to live in, and also, in the modern world, militarily incredibly weak.

And yet, unlike us, they're scheduled to inherit the Earth, by the mere act of showing up.

Liberal democracies need asabiyyah too, and in fact witnessing American asabiyayah in action was a bit of a culture shock moment for me

Is supporting Ukraine asabiyah-yayayay?

It's fair enough if you want no part in it, I'm not here to convert you,

But convert me to what? You don't have an ideology, or a plan, besides "shit happens, the wheel of fortune turns, you can't control humans by rules or systems of rules, but hey people should stick together".

And yet, unlike us, they're scheduled to inherit the Earth, by the mere act of showing up.

Not likely. If prognosticating that far into the future even makes any sense, my money is on some pro-natalist modernist offshoot.

Is supporting Ukraine asabiyah-yayayay?

It's what you need asabiyyah for.

But convert me to what? You don't have an ideology, or a plan, besides "shit happens, the wheel of fortune turns, you can't control humans by rules or systems of rules, but hey people should stick together".

Unironically a better plan than anything any ideology I used to follow could come up with. Also when you act this way, I wonder if FC's apology wasn't unwarranted.

Not likely. If prognosticating that far into the future even makes any sense, my money is on some pro-natalist modernist offshoot.

Sounds like a good deal to me, since any such offshoot seems more likely to come from people I'm aligned with, than any liberal group.

Is supporting Ukraine asabiyah-yayayay?

Kinda, but for European unity. Not as effectively as it could be, but it's there.

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