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PaperclipPerfector  1yr ago (text post)   29444 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of July 31, 2023

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Right... but that effort included fraudulent representations. It's akin to getting some random to walk onto the Senate floor, declare himself a Senator, and cast the deciding vote. It's not a thing you're allowed to do.

It's only considered fraudulent after the fact, when it's failed. How can they have known themselves to be fraudulent when it had never been tried before, and, in fact, was supported by many as a legitimate alternative?

Article II: "Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors"

How exactly did these people end up considering themselves electors?

How can they have known themselves to be fraudulent

Because there is a prescribed process for selecting the electors of each state and that process did not select them, it selected other people.

The fact that a fraudulent process successfully fooled some people does not make it not fraudulent.

Guilty by axiom. How many years do you want to give these electors for testifying to the illegitimacy of an American election?

It seems like the maximum penalty for the relevant offence is 20 years, so that's the upper bound.

How many years do you, AshLael, want to give these electors for testifying to the illegitimacy of an American election?

I dunno. Proper sentencing practice relies on judging many other factors than the mere offence, so the appropriate penalty depends on the individual circumstances of each person. According to the indictment some were deceived and falsely told that their names would only be used if litigation was successful - it seems arguable at least that those people were themselves victims of the scheme more than perpetrators of it.

In the case of someone with a higher degree of intentionality - say someone who believed the election was rigged but was also aware that they were engaging in an illegal act to attempt to overturn it - maybe 2 years seems fair? But I'm pulling that number out of my arse.

Most people don’t think of fraud as something done pretty much in the open and on a political claim.

Fraud is akin to telling someone you have a technology that can test blood but don’t have it. That’s not what really happened here.

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