site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of June 19, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

10
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Many partners =/= high quality. The lowest quality men don't have many partners but many of them are too weak to rape women. The man who has met many fat women on tinder or traded weed for favours from trashy women isn't higher quality than the man who is married and faithful.

Animals either have a fast life history strategy or a slow one. Slow life history strategy is to build long relationships, invest in the long term, invest greatly in your offspring and prioritize quality. Slow life history strategy works in a stable but harsher ecosystem. Fast life history strategy is about reproducing as much and as fast as possible. Quick high risk sex is valued. Fast life history strategy is better in a dangerous ecology with plenty of food. Species whose population is primarily limited by predators tend to have faster life history strategy.

Rape is the ultimate fast life history strategy. Extremely high risk, negative bonding, zero paternal investment and high time preference. The people attracted to that lifestyle will also be more into other forms of fast low quality sex.

A better measurement than number of partners would be attractiveness.

I don't think you're really responding to the point I made. I was arguing that the evidence suggests sexless men are less likely to rape than men who have many sexual partners, and you're making an unrelated point about men who pursue a fast or slow life strategy.

Jocks may pursue a fast life strategy (the stereotypical frat boy rapist who waits for sorority girls to pass out before taking advantage of them) or slow (the high-status MBA who's extremely selective in his choice of wife). Nerds, in this framing, are the low-T noodle-armed dudes who lack the nerve to either talk to girls or rape them. Like, if you hear "nerd" and think of a guy who fucks tons of unattractive girls and is callous about the whole "consent" thing, that's about as far removed from my understanding of the term as it's possible to be.