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PaperclipPerfector  1yr ago (text post)   32956 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of May 1, 2023

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I'm not smug. Sadistically giddy maybe.

I think that my comment is the same thing as 70% of the comments in this thread.
People explaining why they aren't vegans- with their explanation boiling down to a difference in values.

I think my comment points at the idea that which lives by monstrous means is likely to die by monstrous means, perhaps at the hands of those running selfless tit for tat (treat others as they treat others. Engage with each organism by the rules it uses to engage with other organisms, etc). But this is not an argument against carnism.

I mean, who's to say we'll ever run into a sufficiently powerful species running selfless tit for tat? We may just as well run into another race of monsters that we will be better suited to devour if we develop ourselves as monsters. And in any case, rejecting meat for that reason would be Tasteless. Unauthentic. Frightened. Unbased. I personally run something like selfless tit for tat, but I'm fringe. And as I've said, it's not about stopping people from eating meat. It's about respecting the beauty of the principles, joining in on the fun, and developing ourselves as monsters. An almost Klingon sentiment... but for eating people.

Unless of course the carnist didn't realize how based and Jungle-pilled they're being, in which case they should reflect on that and become based and Jungle-pilled.


And as for whether my comment was good. I did write it with the thought that I might need to write this follow up comment. I believe both of them together stand tall.

  • -17

I think that my comment is the same thing as 70% of the comments in this thread.

Nope, you're just projecting.

I think my comment points at the idea that which lives by monstrous means is likely to die by monstrous means

You wrote that about diet. Are you serious?

another race of monsters...

But this is not an argument against carnism.

You're actually pretty funny.

Here's the thing. No one cares about your diet. Mind your business.

lol. What diet? Maybe try attacking my worldview. My diet hasn't come up.

While it's probably not fair to reply to someone banned...

I think this "tit for tat" thing, as if all living things engage in constant IPD, is...irrelevant? Weird? Nonsensical, perhaps? I think people here might be able to argue that not every defector or cooperator gets back what they put out into the world. Some things in life are just plain unfair. If you're arguing that people who eat meat will eventually be repaid by being eaten or whatever, I just don't think that will happen. If you're arguing that we'll have to become monsters if we meet aliens, well, that's just not a given at all.

It's only a 1 day ban. It's fine.

I'm not really arguing either of those things per se... though I do live them. And the fact that I live them religiously is leaking into my posts.

I think these things are worth considering. Any reader that hasn't considered them should. I see that you have done that thinking and have come to more or less the same conclusions that I have. Nothing about the future is a given.

You might be confused because I spent part of my last post tearing apart the idea that my philosophy can be used as a Pascal's Mugging. Saying that we could meet aliens that we need to be monsters to kill was part of that. It's analogous to 'but what if anti-god exists and bad people get infinite reward' in response to Pascal. It isn't an argument that we have to be evil because anti-god exists.

I am of the position that if you aren't aiming compassion at animals you're really missing out on a huge amount of the higher pleasure that you can get from really reveling in the complex emotions available if you really explore the feelings of eating something you love as a sophont. Compassion is not some mere game theoretic mechanism for aligning with other humans. That is a mere use case. Compassion is a tool for gaining a biological and predictive understanding of your prey. This is why it is a higher pleasure. It is a universally applicable learning skill.

I'm the primary 'monster' here. Pridefully so. My use of the word 'monster' in the my top post was careless, and led to needless confusion. I have updated to the belief that there was no way for anyone outside of my closest confidants to make the inferential leap from what I posted. But you can take my intended meaning as a synonym for 'brother and kindred' that evokes 'body-horror exalting aesthetic' with a positive, or complexly meta-negative affect.

Illustrative Side Note: Hit me up post-singularity if you ever want to hunt and eat someone or vice versa. Platonically I mean.

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