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Anyone built a PC recently?
I'm pretty close to biting the bullet on a new high-end, pre-built system.
Before anyone jumps and says that it would cheaper to build it myself (I've been there haha), I've decided the added premium is something I'm willing to pay, especially when it comes with a warranty on parts. I've built several PCs myself, but the last time I did so, I was cursed with pernicious crashing that I couldn't for the life of me solve for good.
The two most important components I've more or less fixed are a Ryzen 9800x3d and an RTX 5080. All I really expect this machine to be used for is gaming, and I want to emphasize single-core performance as my favorite games tend to be CPU bottlenecked. I'd have loved to get a 4090, but the prices are ridiculous. I could get a 9070 XT, but my budget does go further than that. I don't think I'll be using it much for local AI, though I'm occasionally tempted to tinker.
I intend to buy models with 32gb of fast DDR5 memory, and a decent NVME SSD with room for me to buy and install more myself.
I haven't looked too closely at the various flavors of motherboard on offer, but I expect at this price range they're roughly equivalent. It might be a pain to get wired internet, so I'm willing to settle for the speed and latency hit from running wifi-only if I have to.
I intend to skimp on a pre-installed license for Windows. I can get it from [REDACTED] for free.
I haven't decided on all the peripherals yet, but I'll probably get a 100% mechanical keyboard, I own a decent mouse. I'd like a 27" or larger monitor high refresh rate monitor, with QHD being a resolution I'm happy with. I might end up splurging for 4k or an OLED if I feel like it. No need for speakers, as I use Bluetooth earphones and don't usually notice the latency.
I've been looking at an array of retailers, and most seem to provide this in the 2500-2900 GBP range.
Questions:
Anything obviously wrong here? Any clearly suboptimal choices (beyond buying pre-built)?
Can I cheap out on something without noticeable downsides?
My impression, from watching LTT if nothing else, is that watercooling is usually not worth the hassle. I've never used it before, and would need to figure it out if I ever have to swap out parts. I think that a decent air cooler is more than sufficient for people who aren't OC maxxing.
Anyone own an OLED monitor? Did you notice any burn-in? I intend to take reasonable precautions in the first place.
A buddy of mine recently got one of these and he is absolutely blown away by how much AMD seems to have improved with this generation.
If you can score one at MSRP, they seem like a great deal.
The 9070 XT is an excellent card.
Unfortunately, it's very hard to get at MSRP in the UK. Any other time, I'd have been tempted away from team green (my first two GPUs were AMD), but sadly they don't have anything in the performance or price range of the 5080.
That's half the reason I'm buying a pre-built, getting cards at MSRP is an uphill struggle, and when you account for prevailing direct to consumer prices, the markup isn't bad at all.
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If you're going to be installing like three or more (modern AAA) games at once then I'd recommend getting a secondary SSD (nvme or otherwise) on top of whatever you get. The install sizes are insane nowadays and unless you want to uninstall and reinstall games all the time then you probably want at least an extra 500GB SSD (which would be lucky to get you five modern AAA games). Most new games will be at least 100GB if not 150 and they're only getting bigger. I haven't noticed that much difference with an NVME drive compared to a regular SSD but NVME is a bit of future proofing if they finally start doing stuff with direct storage. The best part about NVME is the form factor, it just feels so much better to install than a big clunky box with wires.
If your wi-fi connection drops sometimes I'd recommend getting a powerline adapter. It should be about equal to wi-fi if your wiring is good/new but more importantly it will be stable and won't drop connection if you're going to play games online. If your wi-fi is rock solid it doesn't matter though.
Without pre-installed windows make sure you at least have a usb thumb drive available so you can put an installer on it.
For a mechanical keyboard Gateron switches for mechanical keyboards are usually cheaper and better than cherry switches in most people's experience because they're smoother. They usually try to sell you red, brown, or blue switches. Red is light, smooth, almost mushy in comparison to others. Brown gives you feedback but no clacks. Blue gives you feedback and clacks, like a typewriter. I prefer blues the most but they will be annoying if you hate clicky-clacks or share a space with someone who is annoyed by that (or also play games online with people over an open mic). I'm not that much help on this because mechanical keyboard people seem a lot like audiophiles or wine snobs where I feel like most people will not notice things aside from the major descriptors. For example, red switches feel very much like membrane keyboards to me and I know that's sacrilege.
Another bit of sacrilege, I would recommend getting a controller. Not simply because some of them play better with that (classic example being dark souls but anything with analog movement) but because kb&m tends to hurt my hands after extended play whereas controller usually just wears out the tip of my thumb at most, and more important to me is the lean-back experience is so much nicer than lean forward when it comes to playing games and relaxing. Your mileage my vary and I certainly am not saying it's better in any way but comfort but pretty much all first person shooters/third person action games I default to controller. I know if it's pvp you're getting murdered but as someone that doesn't play pvp games that doesn't matter to me. They are quite expensive though and buying a nice one is important. Also, this depends heavily on the type of game you're playing if you aren't into old emulated games/platformers/third person action games it doesn't really matter (i still play any strategy/rpg/sim with a kb&m). I'd recommend an 8bitdo pro 2 but some people really like asymmetrical sticks.
Sorry, I realize I'm talking as if you don't know how to do anything or what anything is and I assume you know most of this stuff but I thought I'd chime in.
Good points!
Leaving aside AAA games, I download an absurd number of mods for games that support it. I think vanilla Rimworld is less than a gig, I have a dozen times that just in mods. Arma 3 is like 30 gb, and I had 500 more in mods.
I'll just go with the option that has a decent sized primary SSD and buy plenty more as needed. They're quite cheap these days.
I haven't heard of this before, I'll have to take a look into how this works.
Good advice, but unfortunately the majority of games I play, such as FPS titles, RTS games or colony builders, don't play well with a controller. For racing games (which I do occasionally play), I 100% agree that it's a more comfortable and enjoyable experience, especially with haptic feedback.
I strongly prefer mechanical keyboards over rubber domes, but I deliberately refrain from becoming too obsessed with the finer aspects of switches. That wha lies bankruptcy! Even a cheapo mech beats the best membrane I've ever tried. My old Chinesium keyboard had Kailh Browns, and they were perfectly decent.
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I'd recommend paying the extra for power passthrough so as to not lose a socket, and wifi for the added connectivity. All the gains with none of the trade offs.
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How much future proofing you trying to do?
Only thing I'd recommend is make sure you have extra memory slots to expand to 64gb in the future. I noticed recently that Doom: The Dark Ages has 32gb as it's recommended amount of ram. So you know, the 32gb you are getting is enough. Probably be enough for the next few years. But I built my PC at the tail end of 2019 and I put 32gb in it then. It's starting to feel like it's getting to be about the time to future proof with at least the option of 64gb in the future.
Also, if you ever plan on abandoning windows for linux, maybe go with the AMD card? Drivers are supposed to be better, and this latest generation seems to have finally got it's shit together in terms of ray tracing performance. Still lacks a lot of features like ray reconstruction or frame generation, and DLSS is the superior upscaling technology. But I'm currently taking a 20-30% haircut on my FPS for raytraced games in Linux that use DX12. I'm under the impression AMD does not have this problem.
The AMD gpus are still pretty poor at raytracing. If high end gaming is the priority, you don't really have a choice other than an expensive Nvidia gpu. If you look at the benchmarks for a game like the new Indiana Jones or Black Myth Wukong etc, it's brutal for AMD.
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I'm going to be in my part of Scotland for a minimum of 3 years. I expect this system to hold up using extravagant settings on the most demanding titles till then.
Finances meant I was always behind on the RAM train, nursing 16 gigs at subpar speeds till very recently.
I would be surprised if AAA games were that RAM constrained, they're optimized for consoles which are lucky to have 16 gigs of unified memory, and 32 is a healthy margin. If it ever seems inadequate, it's about the easiest upgrade you can make to a PC.
If I can get a
legitimatecopy of Windows, I can debloat it and disable telemetry. While Linux compatibility is excellent these days, courtesy of Valve, I don't see much reason to contemplate a change of OS in the near future.It's certainly not so likely that I would take the large performance hit from dropping from a 5080 to a 9070 XT, even if the latter is a very decent card, especially at that price. I could have easily been swayed if I didn't have the luxury of a bigger budget that can't be better spent elsewhere.
Kids these days. There is always the S&P500 :P
Seriously though, enjoy your prestige build.
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The 9800x3d is a great choice. Unless you're worried about saving 100-200 pounds, going down to a 7800x3d is not something I'd do. Might as well go all out on the cpu and have one that'll be great for 5 years.
Motherboard - I have an ASRock one, and I'm wary of recommending it. They have some sort of cpu destroying issue that they refuse to speak up on. It's quite rare but it keeps happening on ASRock much more frequently than on any other manufacturer's mb. I think MSI is the best choice for mbs.
You don't have to worry about melting on the RTX 5080. It doesn't use all that much power. And you should look into undervolting it. It's simple and saves power consumption (and thus heat and noise production) without sacrificing performance. I've undervolted both my 9800x3d and my RTX 5090. Anyway, afaik, the melting is mostly caused by old power supply units that weren't designed for modern gpus. Make sure you get a good PSU. That's the last part anyone should skimp on.
32 gb of ram is probably sufficient for the next several years. Probably. I went with 64 though. Because I was told mbs don't like having 4 sticks of ram. So if you go with 2x16 sticks now, you may have trouble doubling that amount later.
Water cooling might be worthwhile if you are very sensitive to noise, because the prices are so low these days, and they are more efficient at cooling. But going with air cooling for a 9800x3d is fine as well. A good air cooler will probably last longer without needing to be replaced after 4-5 years.
OLED is awesome. I don't have it on my PC monitor, but I've been using my OLED TV for some of my PC usage (connected via hdmi) for 4 years. No issues. If you take your precautions you should probably avoid burn-in. For gaming there's nothing else that comes close. You get perfect blacks and vivid colors, great response time, and high refresh rates all in one.
Thank you! That's a very thorough answer, and addresses all of my concerns.
Hmm.. There's plenty of DDR4 still kicking around, so I doubt it would be a real issue. I don't think using RAM from different SKUs is a problem if they're the same nominal frequency and timings, but I could be wrong.
A 50 inch OLED TV with VRR is barely more expensive than a 27" OLED monitor, for some god forsaken reason that probably has to do with its niche appeal. That's what I'm aiming for, but I might begrudgingly have to settle if there's simply no room on my rather cramped desk.
You're welcome!
AM5 motherboards require DDR5 ram! You can't combine ddr5 with ddr4. And mbs are now more "picky eaters" of ram than ever, I think. There's a reason the sticks are sold in pairs/sets. They don't play well with others. And they should be inserted in the A2 + B2 slots. The PC might not even boot if A1+B1 are used instead. Mb producers provide a "QVL list" of ram skus that are tested to work with the mb.
Yes, OLED monitors are often absurdly expensive per inch. Some people go for 42" oled tvs and place them on their desk. They seem quite happy.
Sometimes there's a deal to be had on a 34" ultrawide oled monitor. They're nice. Beware that both oled and ultrawide are techs you're likely to never want to abandon once you've started using them. You're locking yourself into a new and somewhat expensive computering lifestyle. :)
Oh, I meant it in the sense that old RAM variants tend to be commercially available (and cheap) well past when they're obsolete. But thank you for elaborating on making sure that the kits match up, in the worst case if I can't find identical models, it probably won't break the bank to buy a fresh set!
I've had OLED phones for a long time, so I know the perks. I'm hooked to high refresh rates, so what's ultra-wide or OLED in comparison? They're down to steep but understandable prices, and unlike GPUs, they're likely to keep getting cheaper. I've been a good boy, so I'm going to treat myself to all the sweet candy haha.
Ah, I misunderstood you. Yes, the current ddr5 sets are likely to stay on the market and go down in price over the next 5 years, so you might get a 2x32 gb set in 2030 for the price you're paying for a 2x16 gb set now. Though this can be highly cyclical. Some years, all ram is expensive, some years, all are cheap.
A few more pieces of advice to touch on your "what can I safely skimp on" q:
The motherboards have diminishing returns above a certain price point. Above £300 or so they're likely to have features you don't need. Though, if you intend on using a wireless PS5 controller (bluetooth) or something, you'll want wifi. The wifi module includes the bluetooth module. They should all have wired internet connection capability btw. That's not a premium feature.
"OC" editions of gpus are mostly bs. All gpus can be overclocked and undervolted. You don't need a factory oc'ed thing. What might be worth paying for is the better cooling on some, not all, of these premium models. Look up a review and look at the noise test page.
The case: diminishing returns above £150-175. RGB fans - not for me.
You don't need a mouse with a 4000 hz polling rate. 1000 hz is very nice and there's extremely diminishing returns above that. Keyboards - get a mechanical one, but don't go above £150.
You don't need a "gen 5" SSD. Gen 4 is plenty fast. Get a high quality gen 4 one for your operating system and perhaps a decent one for storage. Yes, you can use an ssd as a storage drive. They're silent, as opposed to the constant whirr of mechanical drives.
You don't need to pay for Windows or Office. There are perfectly good activation scripts readily available. The ISOs for Windows 10/11 can be legally downloaded.
And just to repeat the PSU claim: don't skimp on power supply.
Thank you again! The cheapest build, the one I linked to in a separate comment, has an 850w PSU from a reputable brand. I presume that's going to tide me over for a long time unless I ever get a 5090 successor.
I had a PC "built" by assembling the pieces in the cardboard box the motherboard came in, so you can tell I'm not overly fussy about cases ;)
850w with 80+ certification is enough for a 5080, yes.
Slob! :P
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Hmm.. While I can see reports of 5080 connectors melting, it seems far less likely than a 5090. I'd consider a different card, if there was anything but older 4080 Supers and Tis in that price bracket.
I'm treating myself haha. I've already convinced myself that a 9950x3d would be gross overkill. Besides, CPUs are far more reasonably priced than GPUs.
This PC should last me at least another 3 years, and if the parts still perform at that point, I'll cannibalize what I can.
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https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B01J471364/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=AOJUIW65VI5BZ&psc=1
That's the cheapest one with roughly the same specs. GBP 2349
FYI Gamers Nexus reviewed either that exact model or something similar from CyberPowerPC and found the CPU was hitting 95C and getting thermal throttled.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=XqCweJmlZc0
You might need to either replace the heat sink entirely or remount it yourself if you get it.
Huh. Luckily the pre-built I'm eyeing (because it's cheap) has a watercooled system, so that should keep me safe.
The one tested in that video was water-cooled as well. They found a wire wrapped around one of the screws holding the water cooler in contact with the CPU that might have caused enough of an air gap to prevent heat from transferring effectively from the CPU to the cooler.
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