This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I wish again I could properly express my sincerity when I say your-this response is very much in line with the kind of conversation I am looking for and I am verily satisfied and optimistic. I made specific claims and feel you are directly addressing them, therefore listening to me, and continuing the conversation yadda yadda. That's the best anyone can ask for on this forum.
"You think it does, I think it doesn't. C'est la vie."
and
"This is an obvious strawman"
and
"the question, "Is it reasonable to ask the question, 'Do leftists care about child rape,' and it is it reasonable to answer it with 'No?'" and these are 2 fundamentally different questions and you are eliding between the two."
and
"the words you added to your synopsis of my comment fundamentally changed the meaning of my comment."
and
"Where did you ask this question?"
are all elements of your response I think are valid and worth time and attention to answer because they are, at least to me, objective rigor and commentary. Unfortunately, I just don't want to do that right now and likely won't in the future if I don't now in this response. And honestly, if I'm not willing to take the time to respond to your points the way I want you to respond to mine then the onus is on me to concede and take responsibility for inappropriately closing the argument. My apologies for the frustration, -50 points to house Leftist, I shouldn't start debates if I'm not willing to see them to the end. Since I am not responding to your points, I think it is fair to say you are correct. I dunno, if I say, "Cats don't drink milk." and you say, "Yes they do." and then I run off without responding, the winner that's left is "yes they do" unless I come back and pick back up the argument.
Anyway, long-winded way of thank you for responding, sorry, I'm wrong, and trying my best to point big arrow signs that say "THIS IS WHAT I AM LOOKING FOR".
More options
Context Copy link