This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I agree with this, and to amplify it: I think Republicans would have done better to write off the Covid elections as "weird" than as "fake." The equivalent of a team losing a game when half their starters are injured, you don't argue that the other team didn't win, but should it really count as a sign of the quality of the two teams?
A united front of Republicans arguing that the combination of the weirdness of the election and the narrowness of the Dem majority meant that it was inappropriate for Democrats to attempt major legislative actions or fundamentally change the country would have been highly appealing. It would have given a hook to a lot of people who desperately don't want Democrat policies in place, but do want the country to actually operate and run fundamentally well. It would have put Democrats in the position of obstructionists trying to keep the government from running properly.
Instead we get periodic infighting between the Election Truthers and the Responsible Adult caucus. We're losing lots of good veteran pols from statehouses to the Senate because they don't want to be pressured to be part of the R clownshow.
To who? Even if we assume Trump is induced to keep his mouth shut and the election conspiracy theories never take off, the ACB/Garland jutxaposition is going to make any suggestion that the Democrats ought to refrain from wielding power seem utterly laughable to both Democratic office holders and Democratic voters.
More options
Context Copy link
Meanwhile, I thought a good faith, conciliatory effort from Democrats would potentially look something like saying, "well, that was certainly a weird election, we did what we could to keep it safe even when it required some last-minute changes, but we promise to return to normal next time". Instead, I see histrionics about voter suppression any time someone wants to take us back to the dark days of 2016 when we didn't have ballot drop boxes in public parks and an insistence that 2020 was the "most secure election ever".
Sadly, there doesn't seem to be any Responsible Adult caucus for this one that wants to admit that it was actually weird that a quarter million people in Wisconsin decided they were "indefinitely confined". I really, sincerely don't think there was any mass fraud, just a general freakout over Covid, but I don't get why it's impossible for people to just admit that this was pretty weird and probably a bad idea to reify.
I agree. Calling a 50/50 Senate a "mandate" to make irrevocable changes is deeply bad faith. Complaining that "two senators" are holding up your agenda is deeply bad faith when you could have just won another 20 elections. Congress is deeply broken.
More options
Context Copy link
You are running off of mistake theory.
Not really though, I'm just hypothesis checking. If the last minute Covid changes in elections had been good faith, I would have expected to see something like I described above. I didn't think the Covid changes were good faith, but if they were, I would have expected a different post-election tone than what we got.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link