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Notes -
You're overstating the matter but yes, the truth lies in that basic direction.
I'll relay a similar overstatement I heard somewhere else: Men are attracted to youth and beauty; women are attracted to anything that wears a suit and treats them like shit.
Not entirely sure what to make of that but I do think about it from time to time.
The ugly man in the suit who treats them like shit or the hot man who doesn’t? Seems more like a bitter divorcee statement than something based in reality; they just go for the guys who treat them badly is a way to cope with the fact that they’re more likely to go to for the hot men, good or bad, than for them.
I don't think so. I think of all the anecdotes I've heard of male med students who can't get a date to save their lives until they get the magic title, at which point they're swimming in desirable potential mates. I've observed this same (general) phenomenon in the lives of those around me with those successful in business, etc.
The reality is that power and status are attractive to women in a way that they are not to men. The 'suit' in the line I quoted points to this, but so does the 'treats them like shit'. That sort of behavior is and always has been a strong signal of reproductive fitness, since it indicates both that 1) the other men in the society are willing to put up with it, ergo the guy acting that way must be very near the top of the hierarchy and 2) the guy knows he can treat women that way because for such as him they're not the gatekeepers any more; he is.
Yes, good looks do matter, but so often correlate with the behavior I'm describing here.
My model indicates that a woman would rather marry a good-looking man who treats her well -- but she gets a lot hotter thinking about the good-looking man who treats her poorly. The one who treats her well is, sadly, sending a signal that he's grateful to have her, which indicates that she could probably have done better.
FWIW, and you can take this or leave it, but I'm attractive, successful, happily married to the woman of my dreams (whom I treat very well), and have enough children that I had to stop a moment to double-check the number in my head.
Sometimes when people say this I think there might just be a permanent gender divide on what constitutes a “nice” guy that is somewhat self-serving, if mostly harmless in real life. What’s your definition of “treats poorly”?
To a woman, when she says she wants a “nice guy”, she means a guy who doesn’t cheat on her, abuse her, shout at her, or expect her to be his servant. Someone who maybe buys her flowers once in a while and puts in some effort. Often to a man, when he says women don’t actually want “nice guys”, his definition of that nice guy is some meek nebbish with a quiet voice who never stands up for himself (or his girl), is probably romantically and sexually submissive, cowers before other men, is probably not hot/fit, and is kind of a geek. To use the analogy of the hour, he’s more of a math Olympiad champ than a prom king.
But this is just reading some weird nerds vs jocks thing into it. There are plenty of men who meet the male ‘nice guy’ definition who are cheaters, abusive, bad boyfriends and husbands (in addition to being unattractive), and there are many strong confident and attractive men, who take control of their lives and have a protective instinct who are also nice, faithful and generally good people. It’s a false dichotomy.
IME when men say women ‘just want to be mistreated’ they’re never honestly evaluating what women see in these men. Sure, there are plenty of women who make bad decisions in choosing a partner, but I’ve never known one who picked the ‘bad’ guy because he treated her like shit. Usually these men are also handsome, charming, have money or other objectively attractive traits. Trashy women date drug dealers because they have money and status, and because like all good salespeople they’re usually charismatic and personable. I could say “men just want crazy BPD hoes”, but if every example I have is of ‘crazy BPD hoes’ who are hot, all I’ve really said is that men like attractive women who are willing to have sex with them, not that they secretly like being cheated on or having plates thrown at them.
I don’t think there’s any reason to believe that, presented with two equally attractive, assertive, confident and charming men, a woman would pick the abusive ‘bad’ one over the nice ‘good’ one. The issue for many women is that, of course, the ‘good’ one is likely to be taken pretty young by some smart woman, while the ‘bad’ ones spend their twenties and thirties in the dating scene.
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I am reminded of an afternoon I spent chatting with a girl (at an event) who had a tinder date for the evening. The date had made it clear that he expected sex on their first date and she was seething. Who was he to demand such a thing, did he think she was that kind of slut, etc.
When the event was finished, I wished her a good evening and expressed my sympathy that she wouldn’t be able to go on her date.
She looked at me like I’d dribbled on her shirt. “Obviously I’m going,” she huffed, and left.
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