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Culture War Roundup for the week of December 23, 2024

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I'm missing anything in here about how the concept "evil in and of itself" is a coherent thing for you to say or to request.

Because once again HE said it was evil. Thus HE has some definition of evil. Whether I have one or not doesn't matter. I am asking HIM to tell me about his definition of evil. I am really confused about how you seem not to get this point.

As to the rest, again my point is I think if you asked the average person if supporting pedophilia was morally similar to being against people being killed I think most would not equate those two views.

I am not making any argument about whether his position is right or wrong. I am saying I can't currently understand it, and asking him to explain. Which he has said he cannot do as it is just something he feels. I accept that as a coherent answer.

You always seem to be reading these as weird gotchas or that I am trying to prove people wrong. Simply read my posts and assume I am trying to understand here and things will make a lot more sense. I don't care if he is right or wrong, I care somewhat about trying to understand a mindset I do not currently understand. I like @Walterodim and think he is an excellent poster. I think his position is out of step with most people, but that is nothing new here on the Motte, and it is possible I am wrong about that.

He said that he thought it was evil. You asked him to show why it was "evil in and of itself", which is different than simply saying that he thinks it's evil. That's a question at the level of essences.

I'm missing anything about what it means for something to be "morally defensible", and whether or not that involves concepts like being rationally defensible, determinable, etc.

I don't care if he is right or wrong

I don't really care either. I care whether or not you're actually acting consistently with your professed meta-ethical beliefs or whether they're just strategically-claimed.

In and of itself within his framework. And he could have answered no. Its not an accusation, its an exploration. Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. But I can't know unless I ask.

There are a couple of issues here, one is that you think my philosophical underpinnings come in to play in surface level questions. Most of my surface level positions are entirely normie, even if my reasonings are not. You can't actually determine if i am holding my beliefs honestly or not from the vast majority of the questions I ask because I simply use the mundane, normal language I use talking to anyone. I am not constructing my questions, as if I am in an academic setting.

And secondly, why would it matter? Whatever the intentions behind my beliefs the question, it stands or falls on its own. If I accuse someone of lying, or have questions about their beliefs, then my meta-ethical beliefs have no impact on the truth of my accusation or the usefulness of the question. Play the ball not the man so to speak.

I'll reiterate again, the vast majority of people (including me, and it seems Walterodim) are not always constructing every single question, discussion or stance based upon first principles. I am certain some of my positions are inconsistent because of that. I have not interrogated every single one. So that they are inconsistent would not be evidence of whether I hold my positions strategically or not. Just that I like most people (as near as I can tell) are not perfect reasoning machines.

What exactly are you hoping to achieve?

In and of itself within his framework.

This sentence doesn't make sense, though. Like, what does it mean?

I'm missing anything about what it means for something to be "morally defensible", and whether or not that involves concepts like being rationally defensible, determinable, etc.

What exactly are you hoping to achieve?

As I wrote:

I care whether or not you're actually acting consistently with your professed meta-ethical beliefs or whether they're just strategically-claimed.