This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I did a rather cursory online search because the two linked articles are sort of confusing as they focus on two different units. The 3rd Assault Brigade is apparently a regular unit of the Ukrainian ground/land forces as of now, and if Wikipedia is to be trusted, its only tangible continuity with Azov is that most of its current(?) members were recruited in the Northern theatre of operations by those veterans of the unit who weren’t encircled in Mariupol. What I think bears mentioning in this particular context is that their insignia was apparently the subject of a rather comical PR move, namely that one stripe was removed from it so as to turn it into something that’s not a wolf hook. (See it for yourself here and here.)
The brigade, on the other hand, that still carries the “Azov” name is nominally of “special purpose” (whatever that means in this context, but this phrase has mostly been an ominous one, especially in Eastern Europe) and is part of the National Guard instead of the army land forces, but that is a difference that is only relevant in peacetime. And no, they don’t carry the wolf hook anymore either.
Anyway, it’s the latter unit that this US government decision affects, but I’d guess this is a purely symbolic measure, because I’d be rather surprised to learn that the Ukrainian National Guard used to have strict measures in effect until now to ensure the Azov does not receive US arms. And even if did, that’d only mean that Azov is being supplied with arms from other NATO members, presumably with rather more strict laws in effect against neo-Nazi symbology than the US.
More options
Context Copy link