HereAndGone
1hr ago
Yes, yes, we're all snowy white big-brained men on here (except those of us who aren't).
Swear to God, I never thought I'd be fighting for the conservative viewpoint of not being a total pain in the behind, yet here I am.
HereAndGone
1hr ago
Men - do all stuff, invent thing, conquer thing, get big brain bigger and bigger
Women - sit on ass, do nothing, grow bigger tits to entice and trap men
This is pretty much what I'm taking away from the Parable of Tidus right now. Wake me up when you have women contributing to the survival of your Viking overlords.
HereAndGone
7hr ago
Each family has a 'sacred fire' in its hearth, an ancestral flame passed on from father to eldest son, tended carefully lest it go out. When it does there are special rituals by which it might be reïgnited, which call upon one's forefathers to participate. Maintaining the flame is but one part of a man's duty to perpetuate the spirit of his male ancestors, as is having a son who might one day take up the mantle in turn. Women in this society leave off worshiping the fire of their father and are instead inducted into worship of the fire of their husband. In a symbolic sense the fire is the family, is the male line itself. (And when you read about ancient peoples' obsession with 'the hearth', you'll see now that it was much more to them than the place where they happened to cook their food.)
Except that it's the DAUGHTERS who are responsible for maintaining the hearth fire and rituals around it. The hearth is more than just "where we cook our food" but it is in the domestic sphere, the woman's sphere. It is Hestia, not Hephaestus, who is the god here.
Men may have rituals around wildfire/need-fires (see bonfire traditions) but that's separate and parallel. Even kindling the Easter Fire comes under this heading, not hearth fires.
If you're at the point where your sexism is rewriting history, I think this entire project works better as a draft for a fantasy novel. Or brush up on what rituals you are writing about so you know what they were, not what you want them to be.
HereAndGone
8hr ago
I saw this before the Kirk assassination and thought it would be great fodder for discussion about the problems the Democratic party have right now with both their potential candidate choice, and are they pinning too much of their hopes on a blue wave in the mid-term elections.
Now, it's something that is so trivial by comparison that it's entertainment. Coconut Queen or Gruesome for Newsom? Who cares when blood is literally flowing?
HereAndGone
8hr ago
I think it is the gayness in part, but mostly that Pete is so white. Whitebread. I mean, I'm white, and looking at Pete and his husband I go "Damn, those boys are white".
He got dragged for not being gay enough/the right sort of gay, so yeah. Dorky white guy with unfortunate name that leads itself to sixth grader jokes.
HereAndGone
8hr ago
Far in the cold, arid north of Tidus, in an island chain where the climate makes agriculture difficult, a tribe of men arises along the usual pastoralist lines. Countless generations of development in this setting, in constant competition with others like them, has forged them into something special. They are consummate warriors, prizing honor and courage above all else. They call themselves, in their own language, the 'Kings' or the 'Nobles'. They're tall and strong and beautiful, of course. They're also, to be blunt, simply more mentally-acute; more prone to the trait we now call 'openness to experience.' Rather than sort of passively existing, they notice new patterns and start to put all sorts of pieces together.
These are the first to tame and ride horses, including into battle. They are the first to invent the wheel. They invent chariots for combat and wagons for hauling goods and families with them as they roam. And, perhaps most importantly for our purposes, they also invent the first boats capable of more than minor inter-island hops. Instead of sending a few warriors in canoes, these people can travel long distances and show up overnight with huge warbands, horses, chariots, stores of weapons, food, supplies, and their women and children too, practically without warning.
This wonderful chapter of the genuine true history of the evolution of our race (indeed, might not one say, our Race?) has moved me to the depths. So moved am I, in fact, that I have to share an earlier, cruder version of this great truth as presented here. Oh, would that I could claim to be of The Race! But alas, I am one of the lesser breeds, the natural inferiors of the noble barbarians of the true North!
From 1926, an obscure essayist named Hilaire Belloc and his paean to The Nordic Man (see page 104 onwards of this essay collection). I can only excerpt certain plums here, but I urge you - all you seekers after truth, after hard scientific fact! - to read the whole thing, inferior though it be to the stellar work showered upon us here.
Behold, my child, the Nordic man,
And be as like him, as you can;
His legs are long, his mind is slow,
His hair is lank and made of tow.And here we have the Alpine Race:
Oh! What a broad and foolish face!
His skin is of a dirty yellow.
He is a most unpleasant fellow.The most degraded of them all
Mediterranean we call.
His hair is crisp, and even curls,
And he is saucy with the girls.The translation is my own. I offer it with diffidence, for I recognize that it does not reproduce the deep organ tones of the original. But it gives the substance of that fine poem, and it is only with the substance — I mean that description of The Race which it conveys — that I have here to deal.
I heard so much about the Nordic Man in these last few months that I was moved to collect recently a great mass of information upon him and to co-ordinate it. Upon the Alpine Man and the Mediterranian Man I am not so erudite: nor is it indeed to any great purpose that I should be — for they are clearly inferior. But the Nordic Man is worth anybody’s trouble; and here is what I have found out about him.
He is the Conqueror and the Adventurer. He is the Lawgiver and the essentially Moral Man. He arranges the world as it should be arranged. He does everything for his own good and for the good of others. He is a natural Leader. Even those who hate him, fear him: all respect him. The Alpine Man sits sullenly at his feet awaiting his orders; the Mediterranean Man flies in terror from his face.
But it is not enough to learn these general characteristics in the Nordic Man, pleasing though they are. No sound biologist could be content until he knew something intimate of his origin and habits; where he may be found, what he does, and how to tell him at sight.
HereAndGone
1d ago
I don't think it could be that fine-tuned, was he even able to hear what Kirk was saying from where he was on the roof? I think it was more "get in position, get ready, take the shot, get out". I don't think what Kirk was saying at that precise second mattered. Did it matter what Trump was saying when his assassination attempt happened?
HereAndGone
1d ago
It also is absolutely going to give encouragement to those who are convinced witches are doing genuine harm (I don't believe spells work, but I also think mucking around with the occult like that is not a good idea either).
So congrats, Jezebel, you have now restoked the Satanic Panic.
HereAndGone
1d ago
Something a little entertaining, after the current storm of words and views and blame being passed around and people joking and rejoicing about the Kirk assassination.
A few days before, I wouldn't have thought of this as light-hearted fun, but goodness me, reality is very surprising.
Kamala Harris has a new book out and guess what, she's not happy with the Biden(s) administration, and former Biden administration munchkins are not happy with her not being happy.
When Fox News attacked me on everything from my laugh, to my tone of voice, to whom I’d dated in my 20s, or claimed I was a “DEI hire,” the White House rarely pushed back with my actual résumé: two terms elected D.A., top cop in the second-largest department of justice in the United States, senator representing one in eight Americans.
Lorraine Voles, my chief of staff, constantly had to advocate for my role at events: “She’s not going to stand there like a potted plant. Give her two minutes of remarks. Have her introduce the president.”
They had a huge comms team; they had Karine Jean-Pierre briefing in the pressroom every day. But getting anything positive said about my work or any defense against untrue attacks was almost impossible.
Ordinarily, this would have been a great chance to chew over the election once more, and indeed the election before it. If Kamala had doubts about Biden running for a second time, why didn't she say more about that? She does give a sort of explanation about that - it would have been perceived as disloyal. "Yeah, but" is the rejoinder there. Was it about loyalty, or was it about personal ambition? Get on the wrong side of the Bidens, and kiss goodbye to any chance of running for president herself?
“It’s Joe and Jill’s decision.” We all said that, like a mantra, as if we’d all been hypnotized. Was it grace, or was it recklessness? In retrospect, I think it was recklessness. The stakes were simply too high. This wasn’t a choice that should have been left to an individual’s ego, an individual’s ambition. It should have been more than a personal decision.
Many people want to spin up a narrative of some big conspiracy at the White House to hide Joe Biden’s infirmity. Here is the truth as I lived it. Joe Biden was a smart guy with long experience and deep conviction, able to discharge the duties of president. On his worst day, he was more deeply knowledgeable, more capable of exercising judgment, and far more compassionate than Donald Trump on his best. But at 81, Joe got tired. That’s when his age showed in physical and verbal stumbles. I don’t think it’s any surprise that the debate debacle happened right after two back-to-back trips to Europe and a flight to the West Coast for a Hollywood fundraiser. I don’t believe it was incapacity. If I believed that, I would have said so. As loyal as I am to President Biden, I am more loyal to my country.
I was well aware of my delicate status. Lore has it that every outgoing chief of staff always tells the incoming president’s chief of staff Rule No. 1: Watch the VP. Because I’d gone after him over busing in the 2019 primary debate, I came into the White House with what we lawyers call a “rebuttable presumption.” I had to prove my loyalty, time and time again.
She claims White House staffers were out to get her:
Worse, I often learned that the president’s staff was adding fuel to negative narratives that sprang up around me. One narrative that took a stubborn hold was that I had a “chaotic” office and unusually high staff turnover during my first year.
Some of those staffers do come back with "yeah, she was chaotic and useless as VP".
One former Biden administration member sounded off on Harris in comments made to Axios, arguing that the former vice president’s own deficiencies were the problem.
“Vice President Harris was simply not good at the job,” they said. “She had basically zero substantive role in any of the administration’s key work streams, and instead would just dive bomb in for stilted photo ops that exposed how out of depth she was.”
“[President Biden was] not the reason she struggled in office or tanked her 2019 [presidential] campaign,” they continued. “Or lost the 2024 campaign, for that matter. The independent variable there is the vice president, not Biden or his aides.”
So the question is, whither Harris now? She seems to have ruled out running for governor of California, so does that mean she is getting ready to put herself forward again in 2028? But will that work - given the split as above between her camp and the Biden camp - and does Joe have enough remaining support in the party to put the kibosh on her, or is he completely gone and she's trying to put distance between herself and the Biden White House ("it wasn't my fault! they didn't support me! I was afraid to speak up! Jill was the tyrant queen!") in order to scrub the memory of the failed campaign?
With Newsom positioning himself strongly as a potential candidate (see the copying Trump's social media style and him being more aggressive on lefty policy, moving back to the centre) does she have a chance, or will it be Hillary Clinton Part Deux: Three Times A Loser?
Arguing over "whither the Democratic Party with regard to Harris?" is way more small potatoes than in the wake of the assassination. Just something to let us all take our minds off heated topics for a bit.
HereAndGone
2d ago
In fact, I'll go so far as to speculate that if Kirk had been gracious in his response, the Tyler may not have even shot at all.
Yeah, right is the only response to this. "Darn it, I carved the mottoes into my ammo, I changed my clothes, I came all this way and the guy is just talking about who's gonna win the next Superbowl? Well that was a waste of my day!"
HereAndGone
2d ago
That's a long comment to say "Kirk was asking for it".
Also, we don't know the guy's motives yet, so all the speculation is just that.
Also also, I've seen it bruited about that Kirk's last words were in response to a question on gun violence, not trans issues, unless that's what you mean by "trans shooters".
I don't think Robinson would have gone there all tooled up, positioned himself on the roof, waited for Kirk to say something mean about the trans, then packed up and gone home if "Oh, okay, he didn't say anything". He was going to shoot no matter if Kirk had been saying "my favourite soda is Classic Coke".
HereAndGone
2d ago
I mean, there are lots of "funniest car chases" and clips from police arrests online, it's not impossible someone was sharing "you gotta see this" and people were laughing and clapping because it was so stupid and entertaining that way. Just really unlucky timing.
Same with Jezebel and their "tee-hee, we got a witch to curse Charlie Kirk!" story. Published 8th September, since taken down. Probably because of stuff like this:
For the "POWERFUL HEX SPELL," I had to provide Kirk's date of birth for "accuracy." The witch performed the hex, but her response was unsettling: "I just completed your spell, and it was successful. You will see the first results within 2–3 weeks."
HereAndGone
2d ago
Oh yeah, if there's any kind of spectacle like this for Kirk it will be every bit as ludicrous (depends on how close he was to Trump, I guess) but the martyr-myth-making machine was chugging away merrily on the left before this.
Oh, Epstein certainly used that connection to his advantage, but there's a difference between "guy has to hit on models who work for his business" (rather creepy and sleazy, low-class) and "guy who meets attractive young women at parties in the right social circles" (eligible bachelor).
The impression I'm getting - and admittedly this is all at second- and third-hand - was that Wexner was socially awkward/dominated by his mother enough that he couldn't manage this kind of thing (unlike Trump who had no problem hanging around the Miss World pageants or whatever). So having a fixer who can make sure photos of you with appropriate arm candy end up in the gossip columns and who manages your public profile, amongst other things, is very convenient and useful.
This profile from 1985 is fascinating; it's a guy who at age 48 still has Mommy very clearly holding on to the apron strings, he's a guy from Ohio who is now a big cheese in New York (and probably aware that he doesn't fit in with the circles he is now moving in - see that little line about "he doesn't pronounce 'La Grenouille' or even 'entrepreneur' right and it doesn't matter").
Wexner is what used to be known as a “confirmed bachelor”. He doesn’t feel alone. He doesn’t seem to want a child and, despite what he says about the perfect woman – Ali McGraw as she was in Love Story, someone who is “very, very pretty” and not aggressive – he seems to be waiting to achieve some mystical harmony and balance in himself first. “A lot of people think because I am not married I am asexual or homosexual, but I enjoy a relationship with a woman,” he says sometime later, hating to discuss this, known for keeping this part of his life very tucked away. Of course, like his social absence, this increases his mystery and allure. Only Alfred Taubman, among his friends, still constantly tells him to get married, but Wexner, whenever asked, says, “Me and the pope.”
So someone like Epstein, charming and comfortable with that kind of society, who could help Les manage his social life, or manage it for him? Worth his weight in gold. Even setting aside any gay attraction, the important thing is that Epstein too was Jewish (and his Jewish heritage seems to be very important to Wexner) so that automatically makes him someone Wexner feels he can trust, someone with the same cultural identity, someone who gets it. Let Jeff manage the money while Les moves on to things he finds more important (new business deals, art and philanthropy) and, so long as profits are being made, what's to question?
(The irony about the perfect woman being someone who is not aggressive is that he ended up married at age 56 to a lawyer. Maybe I'm stereotyping lawyers, but that seems like the aggressive type to me!)
HereAndGone
2d ago
I think Epstein was charming, in that con artist way, because he seems to have had a track record of convincing people to give him a break, to get him introductions to jobs, to let him manage their money, etc. It wasn't just Wexner, he was just the biggest fish Epstein hooked.
The whole reason Epstein is such a big deal is because he had a laundry list of famous contacts, which has now blown up as the alleged paedophile/underage sex scandal. How did he get all those people to come to his parties, let him meet them in their own environments, fly out on his plane to his island? Yeah, Ghislaine Maxwell probably was very helpful in getting access to the likes of Prince Andrew, but Epstein had established himself already when he met her. He was charming, he was plausible, he seemed to have money or connections to money.
You can theorise all you like about "he must have been run as an intelligence agent by some agency or government that set it all up for him" but that alone won't do it; nobody is going to Jim The Spy's party if Jim is boring and dull.
HereAndGone
2d ago
"Ciao Bella" can be a number of things, but one of them is a HoI4 meme.
It's also supposedly an Italian anti-fascist song Bella Ciao and Metatron is angry about this.
I think "general antifa" rather than specifically gamer goes here, with the alleged quotes on other bullets, but who knows until the guy talks or publishes his manifesto?
HereAndGone
2d ago
Why didn’t Wexner measure his returns against the market? Hard to say, maybe he was in too deep, didn’t care, assumed Jeffrey was a genius, liked the attention and friendship, was a little in love, or was just under the thumb of an overbearing and domineering mother (which is the historical record) and didn’t really think of it much.
Yeah, I'm just reading bits and pieces but it does seem to be that Epstein did a genuinely good job of sorting out Wexner's finances, was smart enough not to milk the cow too hard, and probably was a 'friend' (not sexual) for someone who didn't have a lot of friends due to all you describe. Plus, if Epstein was already hosting and/or arranging the kind of parties he later threw, then it would have done no harm (and maybe a lot of good) to Wexner's public image to be seen in the society pages with attractive twenty-something women on his arm. Nobody would expect him to be seriously dating those girls, but to be 'out and about' in public with them would have helped as cover for "oh, Wexner is too much of a playboy to get married yet" if there were rumours about his sexuality.
HereAndGone
2d ago
I don't think he embezzled from Wexner, even the most besotted suitor would have noticed millions drained away. But he did have a lot of control over Wexner's money and was able to spend it as if it were his own, in turn enabling him to present the façade of really, really wealthy guy (rather than just guy in charge of really, really wealthy guy's wallet).
I agree that, like a lot of the high-flying financial types of the time, it was all a house of cards and a downturn, bad luck, or close scrutiny would have shown that the emperor had no clothes. He genuinely had the most amazing luck in getting clear of the Florida sex abuse charges (as well as the dropped ball by the prosecution, as another commenter posted explaining the case in detail on here) and that is what motivates all the conspiracy theories about "was he really an intelligence asset? was he blackmailing people?"
Wikipedia does have a good précis of it all - lies, charm, connections and luck:
Although it took 12 years to deliver the story, as Matthew Goldstein of the New York Times tells it JP Morgan banker Jes Staley and CEO Jamie Dimon had a falling out over Staley's client Epstein sometime around 2012, after in October 2011 the General Counsel of the bank, Stephen Cutler, complained to Staley and others that Epstein was "not an honorable person in any way. He should not be a client." At the meeting between Staley, Epstein and Cutler, the last was assuaged when Epstein lied to his face and trotted out for character reference Bill Gates. The bank would not discard Epstein until, facing increased pressure from federal regulators, it did in 2013 coincidentally the year of Staley's departure from the bank. Thereafter Epstein moved his trade to the American affiliate of Deutsche Bank.
According to Forbes in 2025, the great majority of Epstein's wealth between 1999 and 2018 came from $490 million in fees, (most of that from two billionaires, Leslie Wexner, $200 million, and Leon Black, $170 million) with the remaining $310 million reported as income during that period by his companies as being from investment returns, and was worth $600 million when he died.
HereAndGone
2d ago
No other billionaire gave all his money to one rando with no real qualifications and made that guy a billionaire for no apparent reason.
Just reading the barebones Wikipedia article on Epstein, it seems to be a combination of:
(1) Guy was charismatic in some way, he managed to charm a lot of people; he seems also to have been smart, with talents in music and maths.
(2) He had some amazing luck at the beginning - he managed to get a teaching gig in a private school that was run on sort of hippy-dippy principles (which meant he could get a job there where a conventional school wouldn't have hired him due to lack of credentials, and again seemingly by managing to charm the guy in charge) and one with a ton of well-heeled and connected parents, and he worked those connections as hard as he could (before getting bounced from the school for perhaps being a leetle too friendly with the girl students).
(3) By virtue of those connections, he wangled a job at Bear Stearns. This gave him vital exposure to the world of high finance, experience, and more networking/connections he could later call on (again, he seems to have been able to manage the high-wealth clients well, which would involve being able to create a personal relationship with them: "Jimmy Cayne, the bank's later chief executive officer, praised Epstein's skill with wealthy clients and complex products.")
(4) After being let go from Bear Sterns, he set up his own consulting firm and managed to position himself where he worked with/on behalf of wealthy, connected, and important people. Connections, connections, connections: this seems to really have been Epstein's strength.
(5) Gets hired on by another guy for a firm that morphs into a corporate raider and when this all explodes later on, he managed to walk away without criminal charges for investor fraud. Another combination of luck, talent, and charm.
(6) Set up his own financial management firm while working at (5), and once more his luck meant he landed a really big fish. Indeed, one might even say, a whale. Was indeed competent at the job and sorted out the finances, which means more trust, more personal relationship, more connections. Not to be diagnosing someone when I have no information but it honestly does seem like the guy was deeply closeted gay and so gave over way more control over his finances to Epstein than would have been usual. Epstein used this opportunity to make hay, and while he seems to have been smart enough not to kill the golden goose by robbing him blind, he was able to more or less act as if the wealth was all his (" In July 1991, Wexner granted Epstein full power of attorney over his affairs. The power of attorney allowed Epstein to hire people, sign checks, buy and sell properties, borrow money, and do anything else of a legally binding nature on Wexner's behalf").
Epstein made a tidy fortune managing Wexner's affairs, worked his connections with other wealthy people to the maximum, and was careful to keep up his old networking with figures in Bear Sterns and elsewhere, plus he seems to have been genuinely capable with money (so long as he could resist any temptations to get involved in dodgy deals). So how wealthy was he really, as aside from appearances? Probably nowhere near as much as he liked to let on, but in those circles appearances are what count (see other stories of successful cons of the rich and famous by someone pretending to be part of that environment).
HereAndGone
3d ago
Okay, thank you for the link.
HereAndGone
3d ago
There's a rapidly congealing hagiography surrounding Charlie Kirk in the wake of his shooting.
When we get the practically a state funeral, gold-plated coffin, and mayor kneeling and weeping while touching the coffin as if venerating a relic, come back to me on this. If it does happen, feel free to call me an idiot.
HereAndGone
3d ago
Gay marriage, specifically, was about equal rights
It was about more than taxes and hospital visits, the compromises around civil/domestic unions and partnerships would have given them that. They wanted marriage and nothing less, to force it into the mainstream. Whether or not breaking the last few shreds of bonds holding civil marriage together was worth it for society in the long run, it was a very successful tactic.
However, now there is no reason to treat "only two persons" as the sacred inviolable unchangeable number, so why not "these three or more people really, really love each other and only want to be able to file taxes and visit each other in the hospital?" when it comes to poly marriage down the line? We've generally increased the age at which it's legal to get married, but why not lower it (e.g. if we're going to bring the voting age down to 16, or if we think 14 year olds are mature enough to be having sex and using contraception) in future?
We've now reduced marriage to "the state must recognise we love each other until the time we don't and want to break up" and that's it.
HereAndGone
3d ago
God's law in stoning people like you to death
Old Testament law, now we are under the New Testament grace, not law (since Kirk was a Christian, not a Jew). I think the problem has arisen from American Protestants hammering the Old Testament and ignoring the New except for the epistles of St. Paul.
Charlie Kirk believed it was part of God's perfect moral law that people who are my friends, my family, my coworkers should be stoned to death.
I don't know the guy or any of his beliefs, and there's a lot of this sort of "he was a violent transphobe" etc. rhetoric online. So can you direct me to where he said that (like the quotes about gun deaths and the 2nd amendment rights) or is it just "well he was a Christian, therefore he believed in the Bible, therefore he accepted what the Bible says about X/Y/Z, therefore he wanted me stoned to death" chain of inference?
EDIT: I ask this because I remember the fighting over gay rights where people on all sides were quoting Leviticus, and it was considered a killer put-down to ask those against gay rights "so do you wear poly-cotton mix clothing? do you eat shrimp? because those are banned too, you know!" and to say 'if you don't keep all the laws and taboos, you are being a hypocrite and don't have religious objections'.
However, those on the liberal side (generally liberal Christians) also liked to quote, in the context of illegal immigrants, the parts about "Do not ill-treat foreigners who are living in your land. Treat them as you would a fellow-Israelite, and love them as you love yourselves. Remember that you were once foreigners in the land of Egypt. I am the LORD your God", except you know - that's in the same list as the mixed materials and anti-witchcraft, so are they stoning witches to death? no? then they're hypocrites and not acting out of religious belief!
People cherrypick parts of Scripture all the time; it would be entirely possible for Kirk to be anti-gay marriage but not want gays stoned to death.
Yes, the conception of Servius Tullius. But again, note it is the female servant of the house who is tending with the proper rites to the fire, not the male head of the house.
Another tradition of sacred fire associated with a goddess or saint:
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