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Notes -
Can you define “Iran hates Israel complete independent of Israel status as a U.S. Proxy”
I disagree with this. But I don’t know what it means. Whose Iran?
If Israel could offer Iran domination of Saudi Arabia and status as regional hegemon over the Arabs especially Saudi Arabia then Israel and Iran would be besties.
This is really just oil politics as it’s driving force. US backs Saudis because they have more oil than Iran. This allows Saudis to be the strongest regional power. Iranians don’t like Arabs and realistically think they’re sand negros. If Iran had more oil than the Arabs the US would have long ago found a way to be besties with Iran and made them the regional hegemon over the Arabs. But they don’t. Oil explains the dividing lines in this region of the world a lot more than Muslims don’t like Jews.
I’m sorry are you just unaware of Iran’s view of the “Zionist regime” here?
“Whose Iran?”
Khomeini’s. Khamenei’s. The IRGC’s. The MOIS’s.
The Iranians hold it against the US that we support the Zionists—I think it’s their single biggest issue. Their aggression toward the Zionists is pure.
Iran does not recognize Israel as a state. What fantasy land are you operating in where Israel helping Iran dominate the Arabs is within the realm of possibility?
“This is really just oil politics.”
No, no it very much isn’t. That’s certainly a relevant factor, but Iran would make a lot more oil money if it stopped wanting to wipe Israel off the map.
If you believe Persians think Arabs are sand negros, what in the fuck do you think they consider Jews to be? Spoiler: it’s worse.
“Oil explains the dividing lines in this region of the world a lot more than Muslims don’t like Jews.”
You are simply ignorant of reality here, in particular the nature of the Iranian regime. You can go read the Supreme Leader’s X feed for a bit and you might learn a lot.
Your own view betrays this actually. Why do you think Israel partners with the Arabs, particularly considering it was these countries it has to fight to come and stay in existence for the first 30 years?
In 1979 did Israelis wake up and go “well fuck Iran, let’s partner with the Arabs because of oil politics”?
No.
What changed between 1948 and 1979+ is that Israel was able to normalize relations with its Arab foes (even if the man on the street really hates Israel) and Iran transformed from a basically secular, West-aligned monarchy into a theocracy where the government opposes the existence of Israel as a matter of faith and policy.
The US would fucking love it if Iran woke up tomorrow and became like say Pakistan: kind of a dumpster fire but not a direct threat to an entire region where a significant portion of the world’s energy supply resides. Israel would love for Iran to stop working towards its destruction.
Iran could choose peace. Israel et al can’t choose to ignore that Iran does not want peace.
My best friend is Iranian. Jews are annoying. Arabs they hate. It’s an easy deal for them to ally with Jews if it meant taking over the rest of the Middle East and kicking out Sunni Arab influence.
If you think back historically Jews were always there when the Persian empire ruled the region. Arabs were goat herders. Basically the Beverly Hillbillies today. Putting the Arabs back into their historical place would make Persians quite happy.
“My best friend is Iranian”
Ok buddy. You take one Iranian’s view on Jews over the explicit statements and policies of the Iranian government since 1979 with respect to the Zionist regime.
“If you think back historically”
My brother in history, go read about the history of the Iranian Islamic Revolution and Iran’s stance towards Israel and Jews since that time.
Nobody is denying that Muslims do not like Jews especially in a region they view as their own.
The Sunnis and Arabs have no problem backing the Jews now that it is beneficial for them to do so. If the Jews wanted to join team Tehran and had useful things to offer team Tehran then team Tehran would not refuse them.
Instead the Jews are aligned with the US and the Saudis. And quite frankly the Jews are always going to be US aligned which makes them permenently opposed to team Tehran.
You’re doing this thing where you’re talking about “Muslims” in general, and not the particular Muslims running the Iranian government.
What do you suggest? Ceding all territorial rights to the Holy Land?
You seem to have brainworm that cannot fathom that Iran’s enmity towards Israel is ideological and not related to the fact Israel has close relations with the US (and you have causality backwards there too).
Read this and become enlightened:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Israel_relations
I’ve obviously read Wikipedia before.
Like I said which you ignored if Israel could off Iran the deal their offer the Saudis they would take it.
Sure every geopolitical game is wrapped in other games. And many Iranians don’t like Jews. But they are not the primary geopolitical aim of Iran. Jews also happen to be one of the main players in geopolitics in the region. It’s Russia/Iran versus Saudis/US/Israel. It doesn’t break down on any hard religious lines.
Your inability to comprehend the Iranian government’s underlying motivation and the causal chain that brought us to the present situation is remarkable.
They’re not secretive about it. I’m making no claim about their ideology that you can’t hear from their own mouths. Do you think they support Hamas and Hezbollah just for fun?
If I’m understanding you, you somehow think that the Israelis could simply choose to be friends with Iran by deciding to stop being friends with the Saudis and/or the US. Just a simple switching of teams. Iran and Israel’s enmity is because Israel has chosen to side with the Arabs and the US against Iran. The Saudis and the Iranians are rivals primarily over oil and longstanding ethnic rivalries. Iran and the US are at odds primarily because we support the Saudis and interfere with Iran’s ambitions. The Iranian regime’s particular brand of Islam is not the most significant driving force behind their ambitions in the region. The Iranian regime is just a standard mostly rational actor jockeying for power in its region, where nearly everyone has united against them. Iran would welcome Jewish allies against the Arabs if they would offer.
That’s my honest attempt to characterize what you’ve written.
Did you come up with these views on your own, or is there somewhere this is a common view?
Roughly correct.
We just disagree. Geopolitics is bigger than what the masses shout.
The Jews controlling territory in the Middle East is an eyesore for many Iranians but it’s a small piece to the bigger regional hegemony.
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