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PaperclipPerfector  10mo ago (text post)   26213 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of January 1, 2024

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You want people to stay out of your backyard, stay out of others backyards.

well, Russia should not have meddled in Ukraine's backyard then.

well, Russia should not have meddled in Ukraine's backyard then.

Quit having your dog come through our hole in the fence.

Well, very large part of my lack of enthusiasm toward Russia is that Russia considers Poland as being within their rightful fence.

For me whole point of NATO is to have strong guard dog keeping Russian bear away. Yes, away from they consider their area to grab.

Maybe if they would not do stuff like role playing invasion of Poland and dropping nuclear weapon on Warsaw as part of their military exercises I would be liking Russian government more and would be more supportive for it.

Well, very large part of my lack of enthusiasm toward Russia is that Russia considers Poland as being within their rightful fence.

Yeah, I hear this too. And what's the reliable source for anticipating the inevitable Putin invasion of Europe that I'm always told about?

For me whole point of NATO is to have strong guard dog keeping Russian bear away. Yes, away from they consider their area to grab.

Ah yes. "NATO is justified to manage the security threats provoked by its own existence."

Maybe if they would not do stuff like role playing invasion of Poland and dropping nuclear weapon on Warsaw as part of their military exercises I would be liking Russian government more and would be more supportive for it.

Wait until you hear about the invasion plans the US has cooked up on the backend for its own neighbors. It's a pity we didn't have such hawkish stooges in the Kennedy administration, encouraging him to dig his heels in all the more against Khrushchev. After all, he might not have invaded Puerto Rico.

Yeah, I hear this too. And what's the reliable source for anticipating the inevitable Putin invasion of Europe that I'm always told about?

I want safety for myself, my children and grandchildren. I am not expecting Russian invasion of Poland in 2024 or 2025. But I prefer it to keep unlikely going into 2030s, 2040s and into further future.

And for why Russian invasion of Poland is a security threat... Well, it happened repeatedly in the past, Russia keeps invading and being aggressive and is trying to restore its empire.

(and I am not claiming it is inevitable! if it would be inevitable then trying to reduce risk of it would be pointless!)

Ah yes. "NATO is justified to manage the security threats provoked by its own existence."

Circassian genocide, Russian invasion of Poland etc predate NATO. NATO was created in reaction to Russia being a threat.

Wait until you hear about the invasion plans the US has cooked up on the backend for its own neighbors.

I am not aware of USA roleplaying nuclear attack on specific cities during their military exercises.

In general there is difference between having backup plans and roleplaying imperial invasion during military exercises.

And for why Russian invasion of Poland is a security threat... Well, it happened repeatedly in the past, Russia keeps invading and being aggressive and is trying to restore its empire.

And how many times has Russia been invaded in the last century, approximately? Now tell me they have no valid security concerns of their own that should be respected.

Circassian genocide, Russian invasion of Poland etc predate NATO. NATO was created in reaction to Russia being a threat.

NATO was created as a bulwark against the USSR, not Russia. When the Cold War ended and the Warsaw Pact dissolved, the impetus for NATO should've went along with the rest of it, unless it exists for ulterior motives; and unluckily for the west, Putin isn't stupid enough to be fooled into thinking NATO isn't a military alliance hellbent on economically strangling Russia and preventing it from developing it's sphere of influence.

I am not aware of USA roleplaying nuclear attack on specific cities during their military exercises.

Let me be the first to tell you, 'all' nations run simulations and have attack plans in place for their neighbors. When it was revealed that the US had plans for an invasion of Canada, it was a surprise to everybody that 'wasn't' paying attention to geopolitics.

And how many times has Russia been invaded in the last century, approximately? Now tell me they have no valid security concerns of their own that should be respected.

Can you tell me how many and list this cases?

I remember World War II when they were invaded by own ally, in war they started by invading Poland.

Maybe Soviet–Japanese border conflicts count, but not sure who invaded who.

Anything else? It looks like Russian imperialism in main valid security concern of Russia.

Looking how many times Russia invaded neighbours in this time is quite fun, and managed to surprise me.

NATO was created as a bulwark against the USSR, not Russia.

Russia was/is a problem in its incarnations of Tzarist Russia, USSR and Russian Federation. That is basically the same problem.

Putin isn't stupid enough to be fooled into thinking NATO isn't a military alliance hellbent on economically strangling Russia and preventing it from developing it's sphere of influence.

Yes, NATO exists to preventing Russia from developing it's sphere of influence. In particular, to prevent invading Baltics or Poland. Prevent/blocking invasions of Ukraine is helpful to prevent escalation.

Sadly, NATO isn't a military alliance hellbent on economically strangling Russia. Sanctions were sadly too late and too weak, what exists now should have been applied in 2014 and escalated since then.

Let me be the first to tell you, 'all' nations run simulations and have attack plans in place for their neighbors. When it was revealed that the US had plans for an invasion of Canada, it was a surprise to everybody that 'wasn't' paying attention to geopolitics.

Yes, but not as publicized propaganda exercises.

Can you tell me how many and list this cases?

Well let's see... Napoleon invaded them. Germany invaded them. Japan invaded them. The west invaded them. The US has meddled 'far' more in Russian political affairs than the reverse. Seems to me like they've got some pretty valid security concerns that demand more than NATO's "just trust me bro," sycophants in the US think Russia should be satisfied with.

I remember World War II when they were invaded by own ally, in war they started by invading Poland.

Russia and Nazi Germany had a NAP, they were never official "allies."

Maybe Soviet–Japanese border conflicts count, but not sure who invaded who.

Russia wasn't the initial aggressor.

Russia was/is a problem in its incarnations of Tzarist Russia, USSR and Russian Federation. That is basically the same problem.

Then contrary to NATO's official mandate, Russia's concerns are quite valid if this is an admission that NATO will always be opposed to Russia's geopolitical interests.

Yes, NATO exists to preventing Russia from developing it's sphere of influence.

There you go. And that's how we got where we are.

Sadly, NATO isn't a military alliance hellbent on economically strangling Russia.

Then what explains NATO's actions against them? See The Putin Interviews if you're actually looking for an answer.

Yes, but not as publicized propaganda exercises.

Point: be cynical and draw up plans against your neighbors. Just don't go public with it. It's pretty sad you're going for style over substance on this. If bad optics is the worst you can say about them, I'll happily take the concession.

You asked "And how many times has Russia been invaded in the last century, approximately?"

I am pretty sure that Napoleon was over 100 years ago. (you went with "And how many times has Russia been invaded in the last century, approximately?" limiter)

The US has meddled 'far' more in Russian political affairs than the reverse

For start, we were talking about military invasions, right?

Russia and Nazi Germany had a NAP, they were never official "allies."

They were allied enough to hold joint victory parade and cooperate invading together and sign official documents (secret part of Ribbentrop-Molotov).

Both sides being shitty and running earlier propaganda about each other and one of them being first to backstab is not changing that they were allies.

If you are so deep that you deny USSR/Third Reich alliance then this response chain is not even fun. Reality-adjacent people with alien priorities are fun, reality denial is masturbatory, boring and lame.

Then contrary to NATO's official mandate

how it is contrary to NATO's official mandate? NATO is a collective security system and main threat to its members is Russia.

Then what explains NATO's actions against them?

Which one? The part where they acted against Russian aggressions or part where they failed to respond?

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