naraburns nihil supernum
1yr ago
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Israel-Gaza Megathread #1
This is a megathread for any posts on the conflict between (so far, and so far as I know) Hamas and the Israeli government, as well as related geopolitics. Culture War thread rules apply.
One must also point out that the borders are what they de facto are as a result of an offensive war launched against Israel that Israel defended and took territory. I know the right of conquest is out of favor, but the right of conquest is surely just in Israel’s case.
Can you unpack your definition of an offensive war here? I suspect it would be hard to make it in such a way that it would not also apply to situations (chiefly involving the US and Russia) in which you would bristle at the action being described as an offensive war. The overall pattern since 1945 looks to me a lot like "if the X does nothing, Y will take their land slowly and the modal American will just pretend it isn't happening; if X does something, Y will take their land quickly and the modal American will perceive them as having a just right of conquest in response to an unprovoked attack".
I think you are wrong on your assertion. The US and Russia have engaged in countless aggressive wars. They are (perhaps were) the two hegemonic powers since 1945. I don’t think the US has clean hands although as far as hegemonic powers you could do a lot worse.
Which assertion specifically? I wasn't even going for the low-hanging fruit like either of the two invading Afghanistan; the interesting cases are more of the form of Ukraine's attacks on the *NR (how long do they have to squat that area before any Ukrainian attempt to reclaim it becomes completely analogous to Palestine vs. Israel now?)
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Notes -
One must also point out that the borders are what they de facto are as a result of an offensive war launched against Israel that Israel defended and took territory. I know the right of conquest is out of favor, but the right of conquest is surely just in Israel’s case.
Can you unpack your definition of an offensive war here? I suspect it would be hard to make it in such a way that it would not also apply to situations (chiefly involving the US and Russia) in which you would bristle at the action being described as an offensive war. The overall pattern since 1945 looks to me a lot like "if the X does nothing, Y will take their land slowly and the modal American will just pretend it isn't happening; if X does something, Y will take their land quickly and the modal American will perceive them as having a just right of conquest in response to an unprovoked attack".
I think you are wrong on your assertion. The US and Russia have engaged in countless aggressive wars. They are (perhaps were) the two hegemonic powers since 1945. I don’t think the US has clean hands although as far as hegemonic powers you could do a lot worse.
Which assertion specifically? I wasn't even going for the low-hanging fruit like either of the two invading Afghanistan; the interesting cases are more of the form of Ukraine's attacks on the *NR (how long do they have to squat that area before any Ukrainian attempt to reclaim it becomes completely analogous to Palestine vs. Israel now?)
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