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PaperclipPerfector  1yr ago (text post)   33513 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of June 19, 2023

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Your contention relies on the Germans requests being unreasonable when you could just as easily say that they weren't.

It would be very easy to say many false things, but they would remain false, hence why not even you claim that the German grivance narrative driving the demands was justified.

Not the least considering Poland could have been much better for it, along with all of Europe, if they had aligned themselves with Germany against communism and what National Socialists recognized as capitalism in the hands of the international jew.

Their reward would have been to be colonized, treated as subhuman, and progressively enslaved and exterminated, as per the policy statements and intentions of the German rieche.

My argument isn't selective about anything.

It is very selective about many things.

I think you should step back and recognize just what narrative is being revised. Hitler could have done things differently, but the obvious case here is that so could everyone else.

This is irrelevant to the reasonableness of other people, as Hitler did NOT do things differently, and people were making decisions based on what he DID do, which was unreasonable by standards both contemporary to now and contemporary to then.

In the context of general WW2 narratives that shovel all blame on Hitler in particular, and to a lesser extent the Treaty of Versailles,

These narratives are false, not least because Stalin had his fair share in allying with Hitler, and the Treaty of Versailles was a red herring that was not a justified grievance for German actions.

there exists an obvious angle of blame that is never talked about lest it draw attention away from the great myths we have created out of Hitler and the holocaust.

There are no great myths of Hitler or the holocaust. There is banality of incompetence and evil, and those who wish to dismiss it away in their mediocrity.

It would be very easy to say many false things, but they would remain false, hence why not even you claim that the German grivance narrative driving the demands was justified.

I don't pretend to know either way which geopolitical claims are more justified since I assume all actors are demanding what bests suits them at the time. And the world that would have been if things had gone differently is not known to anyone. Considering how easy you find it to say and believe false things I can only question your confidence.

Their reward would have been to be colonized, treated as subhuman, and progressively enslaved and exterminated, as per the policy statements and intentions of the German rieche.

As per war propaganda driven by those who were at war with Germany. The Germans said the same thing about the allies.

It is very selective about many things.

?

This is irrelevant to the reasonableness of other people, as Hitler did NOT do things differently, and people were making decisions based on what he DID do, which was unreasonable by standards both contemporary to now and contemporary to then.

"Reasonableness" in this context is nonsense. There was nothing 'reasonable' about Germany playing second fiddle to Britain and France whilst the Soviet Union amassed power. Though it's much easier to simply retroactively assign reason to the victors.

There are no great myths of Hitler or the holocaust. There is banality of incompetence and evil, and those who wish to dismiss it away in their mediocrity.

You rely on these myths to maintain your viewpoints. The Germans weren't evil and relying on verbal constructs to sneak such words into the conversation is all you have. Since your viewpoint relies on condemnation of the evil vs good rather than objectivity and analysis.

I don't pretend to know either way which geopolitical claims are more justified

And I know that German claims of being superior to Slavs and Jews and being entitled to murder and enslave them were wrong and not justified. In the end even Hitler renounced claim of German superiority.

The Germans weren't evil

Germans deliberately murdered and enslaved millions of innocent people, planned to do more on that on gigantic scale with large scale genocide.

Feel free to call it differently, for me "were evil" is a fitting description for people doing it, but I would be happy with more descriptive version.

And I know that German claims of being superior to Slavs and Jews and being entitled to murder and enslave them were wrong and not justified. In the end even Hitler renounced claim of German superiority.

What are you even saying? How does this relate to any of what I wrote? 'I know this and that!'

Germans deliberately murdered and enslaved millions of innocent people, planned to do more on that on gigantic scale with large scale genocide.

Then why did the person I was replying to use the concept 'banality of evil'? There's no need for you in this conversation, given your differing views to the person I was replying to, especially since you are making no sense in relation to what was being discussed by us.

Feel free to call it differently, for me "were evil" is a fitting description for people doing it, but I would be happy with more descriptive version.

I am doing so and I don't care one bit for what you prefer given your comically simplistic view on history.

What are you even saying? How does this relate to any of what I wrote? 'I know this and that!'

You try to present situation like Third Reich was in any way on the same moral/ethical level as others. It is blatantly untrue (thought USSR came close, maybe close enough to be on the same level)

I was having a conversation with another person before you showed up with a bunch of nonsense, the relevance of which you can't substantiate when asked. You have been antagonistic and rude and I have no reason to put any value of your subjective moral/ethical opinions, which never held any relevance to the conversation in the first place.

I have no reason to put any value of your subjective moral/ethical opinions

so specifically: do you have any problem with mass murder? Or in general, oppression on a massive scale?

Yes, it's part of the reason I sympathize with the whole of Europe with regards to WW2. And why I believe everyone would have been better off if things had gone differently.

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