site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 20, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

15
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

No comment on this enormous topic, for now. I sympathize. Have a galkovsky.

«...The ancient sages prized military valor to an extreme degree. Abilities for painting or versification were valued much less. Even back then it was understood that an artist or writer is, if nothing else, a pampered, weak, and often immoral person. Such people were loved. They were very strongly loved. But they were loved with the love they deserved. The entire Rome was pining for the pantomime actor Mnester, for his silky hips and lanquid eyes. He was the most popular man in the state; Mnester's glory competed with the glory of the emperor [Caligula] himself, who obsequiously sought his love. The modern "decay" of art is, in fact, a natural and explicable development: to each his own. Nowadays, it is already direct pornography. And it is beautiful. This is the way it should be. This resolution is the destruction of an ugly fairy tale of the 19th century, which turned temples into theaters and theaters into temples. The theater is a temple, but a temple that is not Christian nor even pagan. And now, in the second half of the twentieth century, it was deprived of this status. People come to the theater to giggle. Comedians became comedians in earnest, not hierophants or priests. The theater became again what it was in the Roman Empire - a joy house. The theater is also a joy house in its development: "The theater begins with a hanger". The destruction of the myth of "holy art" is, I think, not a crisis of Christian culture, but a crisis of tacit shadow paganism. Although, in the West, "holy art" was just a fragment of the world, a trend; it is our mythology of genius that has become the center of our malnourished secular culture.»