This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I do know that Putin is to a degree evil (or at least partly a self-serving sociopathic careerist at best, which is essentially the same thing), but I also am nearly 100% sure that he still doesn't intrinsically despise my skin color, my natural expression of my secondary sex characteristics and masculinity itself, etc. and also probably doesn't hate or want to eradicate my heritage, culture, and traditions too much (minus the parts of it that have been hijacked by globohomo to destroy his).
Putin is just banally evil, a simple, corrupt apparatchik qua autocrat of the Russian security state who just wants to be free to LARP as Diet Stalin, take his share of the illicit cut off the top, and restore a bit of the Russian national pride he's made himself a venerated mascot of (and he probably genuinely, as genuinely as he can anyway, believes in it all some decent amount too, which is a majorly redeemable quality). Perhaps the world would be better overall if such people didn't exist (which they might not if globohomo didn't constantly put heterodox cultures under siege, causing them to desperately turn to perceived strongmen in self-defense), but they hardly ruin the planet.
Some 13 year old Iranian girl out there isn't twerking to vulgar and nonsensical dindu rap on TikTok and causing her anguished father to question every life decision he's ever made and contemplate suicide because of Putin. Some 10 year old boy in Venezuela isn't wearing women's clothing and dreaming of his future lifetime paid subscription to the proper functioning of his own endocrine system via synthetic pharmaceutical hormones because of Putin. Some decent enough 27 year old British lad wasn't guilt-tripped and shamed into having a heart attack leading to death from "SADS" sponsored by Pfizer™ because of Putin. Whatever problems Putin causes, he at least has the courtesy to almost always keep them in Russia (or in the case of a certain recent special operation, Russia Jr.). His flaws don't spread like a virus.
I still don't believe the WEF etc. is literally Satanic, because I don't believe in a literal Satan, but they do match most descriptions of the classic nefarious tempter archetype. With that being said, the whole hating my basic demographic characteristics stuff and constantly spreading society-eroding degeneracy stuff weighs more heavily on my mind, so I would say that either I'm heterodox among my fellows here or you're either strawmanning a bit or interpreting hyperbole (I've made a few "I HATE THE ANTICHRIST" posts in my day in response to the latest globohomo affront, but it's just a meme.) a bit too literally.
Though you're right about Jews ruining society, especially the gay ones! (Or should I want them not to breed?)
This is a place for discussing culture wars, not waging them. Yes--I'm aware how rarely it ends up working that way! Nevertheless--it is our aspiration. This is just way too much "boo outgroup" in one post. Your substantive point can be made without a parade of weak man examples. Don't do this.
The last line is literally just a mostly humorous rephrasing of a part of the post it's responding to:
Even if I were 100% serious (which I'm not by any means, as again, it's simply a reflection of its source material), if it's a weakman, then surely so is reducing your opponent's views to "because civilization has been ruined by gays, Jews, and gay Jews."
Other than that, saying that rap is one of the essential exports of Western society is not a weakman. I think any music industry statistic, whether it's listens on Spotify, sales, award show nominations, or anything else, clearly demonstrates that to the point of making it common knowledge.
As for "society-eroding degeneracy stuff", I will admit that is a vague phrase, but I provided concrete examples of it already above and "weighs more heavily on my mind" right after it makes clear that is simply me restating my primary concerns in regards to evaluating geopolitical competitors, not making an accusation that would require further support.
So no, it is not a "parade of weakman examples". Your post strawmanning and mischaracterizing mine is. (If cutting a two word phrase, a six word phrase, and two sentences out of a multi-paragraph post with no context, slapping them with a few buzzwords, and ending with a "Don't do this." admonishment fit only for a grade schooler (a communication habit (that you might consider changing as has been suggested to you or other mods dozen of times) that is very disrespectful by the way to the adults who choose to contribute to your now exiled community even though at this point without Reddit you need every one of us by far more than we need you) isn't fundamentally weak, then I don't know what is.)
Is it "boo outgroup"-y? Maybe a bit, but I don't see how it's overly so, given that it all serves to directly explain a perspective previously commented on (by someone not of that perspective), which is valuable, and because the general outgroup of this sub based on its common commentary seems to those who aren't entirely anti-Putin (like me). That is, I am the outgroup in this case.
The misbehavior of others does not excuse your own. We don't always catch every rule violation, or always take the time to address them, because, well, there are actually too many for us to manage that. So you should never take a lack of moderation as a sign of anything at all.
Your nested parenthetical remarks is nonsense wrapped in nonsense. This is simple: if you do not wish to be admonished as a grade schooler, then do not argue like one.
Everyone is someone's outgroup, though. The goal is light over heat. Your approach was too much heat, not enough light. Do better. Or don't, and we'll ban you. And if that means the community dies, like--I've already noted elsewhere that the mods of this space do not hold its perpetuation as a terminal goal. So, you know. Don't threaten me with a good time.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Wokeness isn't globohomo, just its current face with the mask slipped further down. Russia's been dealing with globohomo since at least Yeltsin.
If globohomo didn't want nuclear escalation, then maybe they shouldn't have tried to boiling frog a fellow nuclear power with far more vile and underhanded kinds of escalation.
Moldova, Georgia, and Belarus also count as Russia Jr. (Stalin was even Georgian), and I don't see how he did anything negative in Syria. Or would it have been better for them if the US had succeeded in illegally couping Assad and turning the whole country into Libya? I'd definitely rather live under the relatively moderate Assad than under whatever random warlord moved into town that day. If I were a Syrian I'd like Putin even more.
Putin didn't do that to Western Europe. Western Europeans (to be fair more the governments than the average people) did that to themselves to try to own le heckin' Putler by... dying, I guess? All they had to do was admit that Big P has a point about NATO expansion and say they'd very much so like to keep purchasing his fine natural resources in a mutually beneficial economic relationship. There's no indication Putin would have been the one to say no. They played themselves here.
Since I assume you're asking about online materials, I read here, CWR, /pol/ on various imageboards, various random Substacks, etc., stuff I'm assuming most people here already know about. What are you most interested in? I'm not sure I have any ultra-obscure links to share.
More options
Context Copy link
I am sorry that you can't find yourself intellectually open to opposing views at this time. Have a lovely day.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link