Ponder
1yr ago
I’m surprised you feel that way on the Motte. The description of this place says,
for people who want to … test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases.
That means you can talk about things you’re not an expert at. This is a place to get feedback and learn new things. You don’t have to anticipate all the interpretations and edge cases initially. If someone finds an unaddressed edge case or interpretation it just leads to useful dialogue in the comments. Additionally, by participating in something you’re not an expert at it causes you to become better at it through practice.
Something intelligent people often say when they get those feelings during in-person conversations is, “Let me look into that and get back to you”.
Ponder
1yr ago
I’m currently reading NeuroTribes: The Legacy of Autism and the Future of Neurodiversity. One thing the book mentions is that historically there were some people that thought certain supplements (specifically vitamins B and C) could help reduce the symptoms of Autism, but that the research was not done scientifically at all.
Are you aware of any research or clinical trials that use supplements/drugs to reduce autism symptoms?
In theory I think anxiolytic drugs would help a lot of the anxiety symptoms caused by having trouble with social cues, and the anxiety caused by uncertainty in the environment. However, my theory is that these drugs can’t be used routinely due to addiction/tolerance issues.
I could see how MDMA (or other entactogens) could cause autistic people to enjoy the company of people more and realize that they have social skills they aren’t usually aware of when sober.
I also think psychedelics combined with a guide could help. Someone could rewrite the story of themselves. They could come to accept that the downsides of autism are the price to pay for having very narrow extraordinary/special skills. Some inventors were likely on the autism spectrum and lived great lives despite being socially reclusive. Many people on the autism spectrum could be destined to make great discoveries or rise to the top of a profession if they focus on their special interests and overcome the disappointments that autism causes in other areas of their lives.
I also have a theory that some people on the autism spectrum do not feel many of the subjective effects of psychedelics.
Ponder
1yr ago
How did that work out?
I’m much more realistic about the expectations of how this will work out. Both LSD and MDMA were used very successfully as therapeutic tools when used in a session with medical professionals. The drugs ‘escaped the lab’ because they were so effective and beneficial at what they do. In trials today people have said that sessions with these substances were one of the most meaningful experiences of their life, that the psychoactive session was more beneficial than years of traditional therapy.
Of course people will misuse drugs and use them for escapism but that doesn’t reduce the benefit for the people that use them responsibly. You can find people that misuse/abuse anything (e.g. cars, prescription drugs) but that isn’t a good argument that nobody should have access to those things.
There are an incredible number of psychedelics and entactogens that have been discovered (see PiHKAL and TiHKAL by Alexander Schulgan). Much of this had to with finding ways around the drug laws to make legal substances. Some are more powerful, some are weaker, some are less visual, duration of effects varies, etc. I think new drugs being discovered is a good thing because each drug may be useful in specialized situations.
Has alcohol make society better...
Alcohol is not a fair comparison; the mechanism of action is different and it is not being used as a medical treatment.
Ponder
1yr ago
Are you of one consistent mood all the time without your concoction?
Yes, I'd describe it as a stoic mood. If it is nice outside I'll think the weather is pleasant, but it doesn't cause me to smile. I don't get mad at people when they do dumb things, I just think that it is interesting or useful information about the world.
Even when I'm in social situations I usually just think about how I can quickly and politely end the conversation so I can go do something else. If I were to be in a social situation with a large group that I couldn't leave then my mood would be much more anxious. That is one of the only times my mood changes much when sober.
Ponder
1yr ago
I struggle with social anxiety, especially in among strangers and in large groups. I believe that I am on the autism spectrum and I do things like avoid eye contact and I almost always have neutral body language when sober. When sober I try to avoid social interactions if they aren’t required. I spend most of my time alone doing solitary activities like bicycling, using a computer, or reading. I’m content with my life, but at the same time I feel like I should get better at social interactions to improve my quality of life.
I’m in my mid-30’s and when I was younger I tried many of the standard recommendations for improving social skills such as: going to meetups, trying new hobbies, and making extra effort to be agreeable/nice. I failed at making any new close friends and I just grew more frustrated at socializing. I figured socializing is just something I’ll never be good at.
I did figure out one way to make myself better at socializing (and to enjoy it), but unfortunately it is somewhat dangerous, involves being intoxicated, and can only be done one day a week. If I take Phenibut (anti-anxiety drug, GABA-B receptor agonist) in the morning and then drink to around .05-.08 BAC at night I get in a mood where I just want to go out and socialize. I become extremely confident and my body language is improved. I also feel like I can sense people’s vibes and read social cues much better (like this person is really enjoying my company, or this person is annoyed because they are too sober). If any social interaction goes poorly (which happens <10% of the time) it doesn’t bother me at all – there are plenty of other people to talk to anyway. If someone doesn’t like me I just find it funny or externalize the reason (such as they are just jealous that I’m in such a euphoric mood). Intoxicated me is all about spreading good vibes and I often do ‘clownish’ things to get a laugh that I’d be way to embarrassed to do sober.
I’ve been trying to use the intoxicated state as ‘exposure therapy’ to eliminate social anxiety permanently from my sober state. The theory is that if I show my brain that socializing is fun and rewarding while intoxicated then my brain will update in that direction and socializing will be more fun and less frustrating when sober.
The problem I’m running into is that I think I’ve internalized the wrong lessons from ‘exposure therapy’:
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I care way less about what other people think of me. If a social interaction doesn’t go well I learned I can just avoid it and interact with other people. I feel way less pressure to conform to allistic norms.
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Instead of trying to socialize sober I can just wait until Saturday to do fun intoxicated socializing.
What I was trying to do was:
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Increase confidence in social situations
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Have my sober state internalize that sober socializing is fun and rewarding
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Internalize that the sober state needed to change body language and communication technique to be more fun/open.
The sober state has proof that ‘clownish’/fun behavior gets good reactions, but I still can’t bring myself to be less serious when sober. My sober state objection is now, “if that is the behavior people enjoy there is no point trying to connect with them because I’m a serious person who doesn’t resort to ‘clownish’ behavior to get attention”.
To use an analogy: I don’t like watching sports. I could memorize the popular discussion points about a sport to get people to like me. But then I’d just be spending my time doing things I don’t like (watching sports) so that that people like me.
The sober state still gets overwhelmed in many social situations because I think too much about things like:
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I’m not good at body language and I can’t think fast enough to get it right
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Is there some social cue that I missed
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Is there some hidden social signaling component in this conversation
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How do I make sure that what I’m saying won’t be taken in the wrong way
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Making sure not to repeat a mistake I made in a previous social interaction
How do I get my sober state to internalize the desired lessons (relax/have fun, people like you when you’re not so serious, be more open with body language) from the intoxicated state?
Ponder
1yr ago
Immune Defense is the strongest, but it is also the most expensive. If you were to pick something else, or a single ingredient from Immune Defense, I'm not sure which would work best. It varies a lot by person.
Ponder
1yr ago
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Andrographis paniculata
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lactococcus lactis strain plasma
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Reacta-C (vitamin C)
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Reduced glutathione
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Immune Defense by Nootropics Depot (blend of Yeast Extract, Black Seed Extract, Oleamide, Tyrosol, Zinc, Palmitoylethanolamide, and mushroom extracts)
I take the Reduced glutathione daily and then usually take 1 of the other 4 per day. I'm very in tune with my body so if I start to feel anything off like a dry throat I'll take more that day.
Ponder
1yr ago
How do I build a stomach of steel?
I've had success with immune boosting nootropics. I seem to get sick less often and if I do start to feel sick the symptoms are minimal and don't last long. This could just be a coincidence as there is no way to really prove that the nootropics improved my immune function.
cost savings
Nootropics will cost upwards of several dollars a day so don't think you will get any alpha from it (possible exception if the nootropics help you avoid a visit to the doctor's office). The main reason to build a stomach of steel is to improve your quality of life/health so you spend less time being sick. Using the immune boosting nootropics can be especially helpful if you are doing something where the food/hygiene conditions are less than you're accustomed to such as: camping, traveling out of country, or large gatherings.
Ponder
1yr ago
One thing that personally helped me set goals was the Hamming Questions of the CFAR Participant Handbook. By asking myself certain questions I was able to find goals that were personally meaningful to me.
What are the most important problems in my life?
If I say "Everything in my life is fine, and I'm on track to achieve all of my goals," what feels untrue about that? What catches in my throat, that makes it hard to say that sentence out loud?
One goal I set for myself was to figure out why I had difficulty making/maintaining social connections. This goal caused me to read a lot of material and act on the new information that I learned. I still have a goal of improving my social connections and I'm constantly finding new actions I can take toward achieving this goal.
Another related goal I have is researching (including applied research) an obscure drug called Phenibut to determine how to personally benefit it from it while avoiding addiciton/tolerance.
This reminds me of the Internal Double Crux chapter of the CFAR Participant Handbook. Here are the notes I had:
Resolve conflicting beliefs by incorporating information from conflicting models.
For example, You want to run but you also want to watch Netflix.
- Rather than summarizing this situation as "I'm just lazy" or "I struggle to stay motivated", it is instead productive to think: in addition to my belief that it is good to run, I apparently also have a belief that it's good to watch Netflix.
The part of you that wants to run is good at paying attention to your long-term goals, your social standing, your health, and your sense of yourself as a strong and capable person. The part of you that wants to watch Netflix is good at paying attention to your short-term urges, your energy levels, your sense of comfort, and whether or not the new Game of Thrones episode seems likely to be good.
…In order to build a maximally detailed understanding of the world and correctly strategize across all of your needs and goals, you've got to bring all of your models to the table…
Ponder
1yr ago
Technology allows us to quickly discover revealed preferences. In terms of TV you might think that most people would like X, but the ratings reveal there are some people that really have a preference for prank comedy.
We don’t know the exact motive for why people like prank TV shows, but it could partially be a social signaling behavior. It signals to other people that they aren’t a fuddy-duddy if they like a watching show about pranks even if they personally wouldn’t want a prank to played on the people they care about.
The same is true of social media. The algorithms show that prank videos will get you a good amount of engagement.
How much of the desire to watch prank comedy is driven by innate desire vs. it being an easy way to socially signal? I don’t know, but the demographics might provide a clue. The prank shows are generally more watched by younger demographics. To me this is an indicator that the revealed preference for prank shows is really more of a preference to socially signal and distinguish yourself from older generations and uptight rule-following people.
Ponder
1yr ago
I don't think people are going to discover a way to frack charity
One thing that gives me hope for the future is promising results from clinical trials of MDMA and psychedelics. I think eventually this could eventually lead to legalization outside of clinical settings. That could lead to something like the hippie movement of the 1960s. This time the movement would have much better odds at succeeding because:
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The government would have a much harder time shutting it down
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The public image around these drugs has shifted favorably
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The movement could attract wealthy supporters
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Lessons have been learned from the failures of the earlier movement
At the very least I think drug law changes would lead to the creation of new spiritual communities that could fill a void for people who are not currently religious.
Ponder
1yr ago
A lot of it comes down to just experimenting and tracking your results. Change 1 variable at a time and measure vitals and how you feel.
Even if you have the science right there are still many variables between people and confounding interactions that won’t be explained. Some people will respond to a nootropic very well because they are deficient in something, some will need a higher dose, some will have no effect, some will get an atypical reaction due to genetics or something in their diet.
You can use the science and anecdotes to find a good hypothesis to test, but the only way to know for sure how something will impact you is to try it while holding other nutrition variables consistent. Try making 1 change at a time while keeping diet/exercise/supplements the same so you can isolate the effect of each change.
Also, if you’re dealing with supplements make note of what deficiency symptoms or excess symptoms are typical to give you potential indicators that you have too little/much of something. For instance, I sometimes get restless legs after long workouts and I found out that might be caused by a magnesium deficiency. I also know that excess magnesium has a laxative effect. So I started taking a magnesium supplement after workouts and I stopped getting restless legs. I also know I wasn’t taking too much magnesium because I didn’t get the typical symptoms associated with too much magnesium.
Ponder
1yr ago
Is it your perception that you're only liked when clowinsh?
It is my observation that I get a lot of attention and good reception when I’m intoxicated and clownish. I’ll talk to a double-digit number of strangers in the night and feel great about 90%+ of the interactions.
When sober I’m too shy to talk to strangers unless there is some shared purpose (such as needing to meet with an employee to discuss something for work). I’m also pretty sure I’m unknowingly giving off closed-off body language verbally so interactions quickly run out of steam and most people don’t initiate interactions with me.
Have you told any of the women that you've met that you're looking for a wife and mother of your children? Even if it's only in general and not her specifically?
I’m only looking for a long-term monogamous relationship but not marriage. Going through the breakup of a long-term relationship was one of my most emotionally devasting experiences in life. I can’t risk going through a divorce. I know the odds are stacked against me for having a successful marriage.
I have no interest in kids. I have too much trouble with social interactions and I would have trouble raising a kid. I don’t really like interacting with other people’s kids either. A kid would have higher risk of being on the autism spectrum.
It can help you by getting this larger social group that already likes you
I agree with you here. I should appreciate the attention that I get for being clownish and potentially people may also come to like my other qualities. Even the clownish behavior has an interesting backstory and does showcase some good qualities (like cleverness, confidence, and not being too uptight).
Do you have any proxies to help identify the sort of woman you want?
I feel like any of these could have potential:
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Science background – proxy for interest in truth and not being too caught up in tribal politics.
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Healthcare worker – Honest signal of selflessness (devoting yourself to tough career that isn’t all the financially rewarding compared to the alternatives).
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Background in using/researching psychedelics – proxy for open-mindedness and having compassion for people with mental illness.
Ponder
1yr ago
That makes a lot of sense and I have slowly been taking my life in a direction where I just cut out people if they are too politically tribal or obnoxious. I have been much happier as a result and I’m slowly rebuilding my social network with people who enjoy rational nuanced conversations.
But sometimes the “tribal ritual people” have things that you need and you are forced to interact with them. For instance, at college or work you must go along with many tribal rituals if you want a degree or to continue working for an employer.
I also have internal conflicts with just cutting people out of my life. I feel like I should help them be more rational because it will improve their life. I know I can’t help them though. In an idealistic hypothetical world everyone is nice to each other and tries to help everyone, not just their tribe. It somehow feels morally wrong to not try to help people in need. Rationally, it is probably correct to cut ‘irrational’ out of your life because the net benefit of focusing on rational goals is better for society than me wasting time/energy on people that I can’t change. It still produces an emotional dissonance where it doesn’t feel like I’m doing the right thing.
Ponder
1yr ago
That makes sense, but I think the ‘crux’ of the issue something different.
To use an analogy: I would like to buy a house, but I don’t want to pay the current market price. If I buy a house I’ve made commitment that makes me more dependent on my job and that is a feeling that don’t like.
I want to be desired and liked by other people, but I don’t want to pay the cost of having to conform to the social rules. Then I have a lot of internal conflict because I have two competing desires: the desire not play ‘dumb’ social games and the desire to be liked. I can either be unhappy because I’m not desired by other people, or I can be unhappy because I’m playing ‘dumb’ social games.
I’m actually a well-known regular at some of the local bars. Lots of people chat with me (including women I find attractive) and I have fun social experiences. However, the people that like me at the bar like me because of my ‘clownish’ entertaining antics. I want to be desired because I’m a thoughtful, analytic, ‘nice’, and reliable person. But in order to ‘turn-on’ my social mode I have to be intoxicated to a level where I’m no longer very thoughtful or analytical. I can think of many ‘clownish’ ways to get attention that cause other people to like me. But I don’t want to be liked/desired for ‘clownish’ behavior. And I can’t figure out how to be socially successful without being ‘clownish’. The people I meet at bars want the fun guy that knows how to party, not the thoughtful/analytical guy that I’m the other 90% of the time.
Ponder
1yr ago
It kind of goes against the culture of this place. The whole reason the community exists is because of SSC, which is know for having incredibly long posts. The length makes things more interesting, accurate, and entertaining.
In order to have meaningful discussion you often have to explain the models and assumptions about reality that lead to your main point.
If someone feels a post is too long and could be summarized, they could just respond to the original post with that feedback. Maybe the poster will incorporate that feedback and make shorter posts, or maybe it turns out the excess elaboration is necessary.
This place fills a niche where you can have long-from discussions on controversial issues and has rules that facilitate that purpose. There are other places to go if you want to have more succinct discussions. I don’t think this place should try to focus more on brevity just because that is what other places do. People come here because we aren’t like those other places.
Ponder
1yr ago
Before I started reading about rationality, I used to get frustrated because I felt like people often acted ‘irrationally’ when talking about politics. Then I started reading things like, “I Can Tolerate Anything Except The Outgroup” and “The Scout Mindset”. Everything started making sense; people have a desire for tribal belonging and they need to signal allegiance to a tribe as well as establishing their place in the tribe. When someone says something, it often isn’t meant to be taken as an objective claim about how the world really it is. It is often just a social ritual.
Often people are consciously unaware that they are participating in these social signaling games. They just believe whatever they are saying is true even if they are presented with an obvious and rational explanation for why the belief is incorrect. I speculate at the subconscious level creating a ‘boo outgroup’ post on social media is releasing dopamine because the brain is wired to reward social approval from your tribe. Then people come up with a rationalization for why they have to keep repeating the tribal behavior.
Once I updated my model of the world with people having these tribal behaviors things become much more predictable. On the other hand observing the tribal model being accurate leads to a kind of depressing realization. Most people are just soldiers for their tribe and if you don’t have a position of power in the tribe it is very hard to get people to change and get people to act in a more ‘rational’ way. The soldiers have positions of power and make rules/laws/social conventions that they force on other people. Sometimes the primary outcome of decisions is just to punish the outgroup regardless of the cost to society.
Furthermore, technology allows people to exploit this tribal thinking to manipulate other people to act in their economic or political interest. A lot of the internet is just designed to make people feel like they are part of ‘a tribe’ and most people end up consuming/creating a ton of ‘boo outgroup’ content. Combined with scope insensitivity, the availability heuristic people, and other cogitative biases many people end up with an incredibly inaccurate understanding of reality.
How do you cope with the reality that these tribal incentives drive a lot of human behavior? We are destined to live an ‘irrational’ world where people are caught up in these tribal games. I feel like many people don’t have much to offer beyond their tribal behavior. If all someone does is repeat political talking points they aren’t useful. It is a waste of my time and energy to interact with these people. How do I avoid become jaded and disconnected from people?
Ponder
1yr ago
But I also want to use them and do integration sessions under the supervision of a medical professional (or an experienced user at minimum).
Even with Phenibut I hit a vulnerable state on the comedown where I become aware of beliefs that I don’t notice when I’m sober. I become very open to admitting that my routines and patterns of behavior may not be optimal and I become very open to the idea of making changes. For instance, I’ll tell myself that I should connect more with people and make an effort to call people or message people more often. But then I sober up and my rational defenses return – I don’t like making phone calls and messaging people usually leads to pointless small talk so I avoid it. When I’m in the vulnerable state it would be great to have someone to talk through these things with so that I have a higher chance of following up when sober, or so that they can optimize the plan so it is more is more palatable to my sober self.
Ponder
1yr ago
Thanks for the detailed and thoughtful response.
There actually is something like a fraternal service organization near me that I’ve started exploring. I was recently thinking about how I might try to become more involved with it.
Every once in a while I’ll cycle with a friend, but I prefer cycling alone. I’ve come to be very content and at peace with being alone. I find social interactions too frustrating; the effort does not seem to be worth the reward anymore. I’ve only come to feel this way as I’ve hit my 30’s. When I was younger I was much more hopeful that my social skills would improve and that I could meet a girlfriend and add some close friends to my social circle. ‘System 2’ thinking now tells me just give up on improving social skills and focus more on being content with everything else in my life. However, there is still a ‘System 1’ desire for more social connection in my life. The ‘System 1’ desire is mostly buried when I’m sober.
I used to volunteer with dogs before the pandemic and I enjoyed that, but I never made any lasting connections from it (because I had a specific shift and you always interacted with the same handful of people). Sometimes I’ll get really interested/focused on the stock market, but I no longer try to actively invest – it caused too much anxiety and was a distraction to think about during work hours.
The thing with psychedelics is that there is a non-zero chance of something bad happening from breaking the law. I could lose my job or go to jail if I trusted the wrong person. Granted, this is very unlikely to happen especially because I live in a place where the enforcement of psychedelic laws is pretty lax. I still have anxiety about it though because I lack the social skills to navigate interactions about illegal activities. Additionally, I want to be able to openly talk about psychedelics with family/friends and I don’t feel comfortable doing that when they are illegal. It would just be another part of me that I have to keep quiet about around most people.
Ponder
1yr ago
I’m stuck not having the social life I want. Other than my 1 close friend I’ve gotten worse at making and maintaining friendships. I just have too many disappointing experiences with sober social interactions that I’ve learned it is just hopeless to continue trying to cultivate friendships.
If psychedelics were legal I feel like I could get my life unstuck. I could make friends with people that explore psychedelics because they would be more open to being friends with a neurodiverse person. When I’m knowledgeable and/or passionate about a topic it becomes much easier for me to make friends. It just doesn’t work with psychedelics because it is not something I feel comfortable openly discussing due to the legal status. At the very least I could use psychedelics to change my perspective on life and feel more appreciative about things instead of focusing on what I missed out due to being on the autism spectrum.
I would say the major problem is that I don’t have the level of social connection that I desire (especially a girlfriend, even though I have a low sex drive). I also can’t openly discuss/explore psychedelics which has become a major passion of mine. The other things I’m interested in are mostly solitary and don’t lead to social connection.
I go to the gym and bicycle a lot, but I don’t really consider a goal because it is just a routine I’ve been doing for so long. I do have a goal to read a lot more this year. I already have a bunch of books selected, but I’ve been spending my reading time on Reddit instead of getting to the books. I also started a new job this year so my goal is to continue making a good impression and improving processes.
Ponder
1yr ago
I’m in my mid 30’s and I have recently come to the realization that I’m on the autism spectrum and that I have lived most of my life without knowing this. I always thought I was just kind of shy. Since I wasn’t like the autistic people in special classes I never considered that I may also be on the spectrum, just to a much lesser degree.
For much of my life being on the autism spectrum caused me no noticeable problems. I was a great student and I had school, video games, and Magic: the Gathering to keep me occupied. I didn’t have many friends, but I had a close friend, and people seemed to respect me because I was book smart.
After I graduated college, the autism became more of a problem. I was behind on social milestones (only had gone on a handful or dates, no long-term girlfriend, being on a much slower career trajectory than my peers due to lack of social skills even though I had the technical competence). People in my life were becoming less centrist and more polarized and I started losing interest in trying to make/maintain friendships.
I can often think of insightful/interesting things to add to many conversations, but I mostly don’t say them due to fear of them not meeting someone’s social expectations. My body language is mostly neutral. I don’t smile much and I avoid eye contact. I think far too long about things because my brain is slower at processing social information than a neurotypical person. I use more rule-based thinking and try to model how other people perceive things. Even when I say the thing people want to hear it takes me longer to come up with what I’m going to say and I feel like I come off as unnatural. When I inevitably say/or do something that people respond poorly to I dwell on it for a long time and keep thinking about what I should have done differently. Over time I’ve learned that I can’t please most people because autism prevents me from acting like a neurotypical person no matter how hard I try. Even if I memorize a ton of social rules and prepare for many conversation paths it just frustrates me that I have to ‘pretend’ and ‘play social games’ in order to be liked. I now avoid many social interactions because they are frustrating and I gain very little from them.
Back when I was trying to improve my social skills I put a lot of effort in to trying to get better. I would go to meetups and volunteer and generally try to be likable. Nothing much came from my efforts and it just caused me to become more frustrated with social conventions. For reference, I also exercise a lot and am in good physical shape and am 5’ 11’’.
The most success I had at growing my social skills was when I moved to an apartment with a pool and I would drink on the weekends and make friends at the pool. Those friendships were ephemeral and didn’t last after I moved to a different apartment. I also didn’t like that I was drinking up to 2 days a week and was starting to get mild hangovers and alcohol was in conflict with my otherwise healthy lifestyle.
In an effort to give up drinking but remain social I switched to a Gaba-B receptor agonist called Phenibut. I only use it once a week to avoid tolerance and addiction. It is kind of like alcohol but without the impairment. It made me feel calm/relaxed and mildly more social. It wasn’t quite strong enough, and being a truth-seeker, I felt emboldened to disregard the very strong warnings about never mixing alcohol with Phenibut to find out what would really happen. Technically, this is very dangerous combination because combining depressants can lead to unpredictable synergistic effects that cause too much respiratory depression. On the other hand, most reports said the combination was usually just like every beer you drink feels like 2-3 beers. I felt it should be mostly safe to use a low dose of Phenibut and have 1 drink. It was a euphoric feeling and eventually I developed a higher dose protocol that I now use up to once a week. I never exceed .05-.08 BAC and always wait >4 hours after the Phenibut to drink. Even that could be dangerous for some people so please do not mix Phenibut and alcohol.
The downsides to mixing Phenibut + alcohol that I’ve personally noticed:
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Way easier to accidently have short-term memory impairment. Even at .05 BAC I forget some minor details.
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Alcohol is bad for your body.
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Sleep cycle gets interrupted and I get tired out more easily on sober days.
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Very unfiltered – easy to accidently say something offensive or do something you regret later.
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Emotions feel much stronger and it becomes harder to regulate emotionally driven behavior. (I have a very chill personality so I never got into a fight or anything).
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Sober people find your behavior off-putting and distance themselves from you. I care less and less about trying to fit in even when I’m 100% sober. I avoid sober interactions even more because they are dull and boring compared to my fun Phenibut interactions.
The Phenibut + alcohol protocol made me feel extreme social confidence (but you definitely appear intoxicated), euphoria, a desire to socialize, music sounds amazing, a calm/relaxed feeling that lasts for about 24 hours, near zero social anxiety, and a minimal hangover. In an order to use the protocol to improve my sober life I further developed an exposure therapy protocol while intoxicated. I would go to the bars to ‘esoteric dance’. To my surprise many people would appreciate my weird behavior and would say things like I gave off good vibe or they wanted to try the ‘esoteric dance’ with me. I then internalized many lessons that made sober socializing much easier:
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Socializing can be fun
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Being polarizing can be fun, the social limits are often way further than where you think they are
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Most people aren’t judging you as harshly as you judge yourself
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Bad reactions can easily be rationalized away (such as: that guy was just jealous of the attention I was getting)
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If people don’t like you then just avoid them and find someone who does like you
When I sober up my social anxiety is permanently decreased from baseline, but I still overthink things and struggle with social interactions. I just now care far less about other people’s opinion of me and a social interaction gone bad doesn’t really even bother me anymore. I don’t think I’ve gotten much better at sober interactions though as most of the social skills don’t translate into sober environments. I also haven’t been able to leverage my new social skills to get a girlfriend. The problem is girls like me when I’m intoxicated but I’m only like that 1 day a week max. My personality is completely different when I’m sober.
On the other hand I feel much better now that I figured out how to connect with people and feel desired. It is kind of depressing that people like me so much better when I’m intoxicated than sober though.
I feel like I need to do more work and self-improvement to fix the issues in my life. I need to deal with the trauma of living life so long with undiagnosed autism, and to develop better social skills when sober. Continuing to use Phenibut and alcohol with exposure therapy can’t fix the remaining problems.
I don’t think regular therapy is the answer because I think I need psychoactive substances to access and modify subconscious beliefs. My rational defenses are too strong for traditional therapy. I don’t trust the medical establishment because:
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Psychoactive psychotherapy is illegal despite all the research showing that it is effective.
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US medical professionals don’t understand much about Phenibut and the one time I mentioned it to a doctor they are just like you should quit using it. My vitals/bloodwork are all in healthy ranges.
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I have asymmetric hearing loss and I was told I’m not a hearing aid candidate. I don’t have much hope that the medical establishment can fix my issues.
I also get very frustrated that psychedelics are illegal because I think if I could legally take them under the guidance of a therapist I could fix a lot of my issues without the dangerous alcohol and Phenibut combination. I’m too distrusting of people and bad at social interactions to try to find someone from the psychedelic underground.
Anyway, I just feel kind of stuck in life and I don’t see any good options on how I can fix the major problems in my life. Any ideas/feedback would be appreciated.
I'd prefer to live in a society where people had the legal option to choose psychedelics over alcohol as their recreational drug of choice.
Psychedelics are far more physically safer: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Drug_danger_and_dependence-small.png
Users are far less likely to harm themselves or others when under the influence as compared to alcohol: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-11660210
Psychedelics can cause you to quit more harmful drugs such as alcohol: https://www.nature.com/articles/nature.2012.10200
Additionally, psychedelics can inspire users to invent things, become more connected with the world, or feel a greater sense of purpose. Many psychedelics are non-addictive and can cause people to realize that they no longer need any drugs in their life.
If people switch from alcohol/pain-killers/benzos to psychedelics as their recreational drug of choice I think the net result would be less crime due to the drug effects being so different.
If people commit crimes (other than use/possession/distribution) then they should be held accountable in the same way as someone who committed the same crime sober.
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