Immediate_Bit
9d ago
It has to be on the scale of de-nazification but I think it's doable. Complete disarmament of the populace. Choosing new winners. If people want to go and hide in the mountains/foreign countries you can keep them there with drones/border control. Levels of security need to match levels of resistance, but once everyone is more prosperous than before and the most resistant have been dealt with it should be pretty stable.
People respect power and competence including everyday Arabs. Yes, done poorly it will be a shit show (and shouldn't be done at all), but for a competent regime with modern tech it shouldn't be hard.
But you do have to classify them as an enemy nation which, if they got a nuclear weapon, would use it against you or allies, in order to justify the de-nazification treatment. And I do think you would need direct foreign rule for decades to ward off insurrection because they are a more foreign culture than Germans.
Immediate_Bit
10d ago
This reinforces my belief if you do these things you have to do them properly. If you go in and say "This "death to America" thing has gone on too long. We will rule you for 100 years." you have a good chance of success. Overwhelming force; casualty rate will be higher, but achieving ultimate victory will be popular. "We now have monarchic control of a 90M person country who we've spent the last 40 years preventing from getting a nuke because they have every intention of using it" sells pretty well.
Putin made a similar mistake in Ukraine. Limited military operations don't work if your counterpart is not willing to go along.
Of course America is not a politically serious country and this kind of thought is not acceptable. Sort of a nightmare scenario for this kind of failure because these are religious zealots who have sufficient resources for serious retaliations both now and in the future.
Immediate_Bit
10d ago
You have to have a total victory where the regime has a different perspective on immigration. Everything else is just delay tactics.
Immediate_Bit
17d ago
This is completely egregious with regards to Elon. I don't think you appreciate the magnitude of achievement of starting a new (electric) car company in a country when a new successful car company hadn't been started for decades. Similar for rockets, where the private industry was incredibly inefficient and the public side almost completely ineffective. If he'd done this with purely inherited money it would still be incredible. I think he has personality flaws but his work input and entrepreneurial ability are not matched.
Cuban is correct. He was a pretty good NBA owner. Above median. Witless when he sold the team - and seems to be developing more liberal witlessness the older he gets. Licking a dirty boot can do strange things.
Ballmer seems right also. His era was when Microsoft was heavily hamstrung by anti-trust. He doesn't seem like a good NBA owner - given that's all we have to go off.
I think Bezos worked extremely hard and knew how to make consistently good business decisions, which if you've ever worked with other people isn't trivial. Much like Elon I think he has personality flaws.
The funny thing about these 4 is the 2 with the highest levels of social intelligence (Cuban and Ballmer) have the least case for true business brilliance, while the other two are less savvy but have better resumes.
You don't necessarily have opportunities to evaluate these guys if they don't take repeated swings. Some people are just carried on good business waves. Pretty hard to argue against Elon and Bezos though, given the breadth and success of their product/service suites.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
To me this case spoke more strongly to the nature of the French, who I have always disliked.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
She wrote the Bible for Liberal kids, effectively.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
Lying to game the system is a submission to the system and reinforces the judge's position.
Sincere regret is a submission to actual morality and needs to be punished.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
Embedded in the demand for concern is the demand to take risk to bring about the positive outcome. Maybe life hasn't gone that well for you. Outcomes are very unfair by luck and nature. And yet it is you who is being asked to bare the burden; not someone from the natural aristocracy, who can fail and land on a gold hill. I reserve my contempt for the aged and wealthy who are very much in a position to do and say positive things and do not. Transferring this burden is very much "send young men to die in old men's wars".
And further, when you're asking them to engage, you're asking them to engage with power. Most people on this forum they can engage in political conversations and not worry about things flying over their head. As long as they're reasonably informed they'll be ok. The 100iq person has to worry about getting ragdolled and humiliated. At least if you are humiliated you'll know it's because you weren't prepared. For them it stings. They can't just show up better next time. It's a game played by their betters. Better to drink what's coming down the pipe. These people still have fully Shakesbeardean existences, just not with regard to politics.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
I think the NPC criticism, while correct, is deployed overly aggressively. These people understand their place in the system and their relative irrelevancy. Making banal statements to signal loyalty to the group most loyal to you is rational. Hyper-analysing things for truth is costly. Knowing that you are a peasant and that what matters most to you are your material concerns and competitions with those around you is wise, even if mostly unconsious. Democracy requires three things: intelligence, engagement and character. Of course you should be blackpilled.
This is especially true of the intellectual class who actually do something more sophisticated. They understand truth on an unconscious level (they have to) and then warp their whole being to succeed in society. This is more sophisticated than our autistic analyses. Anti-social? Yes. But people level critiques of idiocy when they should be levelling critiques of character.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
I would counter that it was a wild success. They demonstrated they can riot with impunity and use this to threaten their opposition at will. Wokeness (just universalism) is further entrenched. Two steps forward one step back is a very successful long term strategy.
Immediate_Bit
1mo ago
What I find really grating about this conversation is that you live in a deeply unserious society, and then when something like this happens people are like oh my god wow how could this have possibly happened. As if all your institutions will just somehow magically be immune to the social and moral decay of the last 100 years. Same thing with the secret service and Trump assasination attempt. I guess a similar thing with covid. All this hand wringing; no where near the root issue, nor even approaching it.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
Everyone seems to be assuming it was from the American side. Just as likely to be a Venezuelan.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
Saying they will run Venezuela is interesting because, much like the hysterical Somilia tweet, the rhetoric is correct but the action seems to be missing. They need to retire the existing government and appoint someone, but I don't think the appetite or seriousness will be there, nor would the seriousness to sustain it be there outside this presidency.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
You make the case like you have and if it doesn't (can't) get heard - you defect. The longer you play along the longer you incentivise the status quo. But I probably wouldn't have the balls to defect also.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
Top 5 comment all time.
You could also greatly simplify credentialling and training. Doctors don't feel like they have it great because the training hours are unnecessary and shit. Even the work hours can be pretty bad in US once qualified. Train more, work fewer hours, more open/simple credentialling.
Single payer has a very ugly aspect to it that you see when you are exposed to it a lot. There's a good book written by an Indian about it in England (forget the name). I've seen people come to ER and get a bed because their wife was in. Complain of some general stomach pain. Unable to elicit any signs. Probably the current system has this as well. It's just a very ugly thing when you make something free for common good and the underclass abuse it in ways that make you want to put them on the moon.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
I had the exact opposite reaction. I think everything in the article is excellent up until the app idea. It's totally unnecessary. Trump could have marched over government. People vote for the president and expect them to lead. If "the law" is in the way then get it out of the way.
You don't need it to staff government. If you set out a competent agenda you will get talent from everywhere.
People just need/want to vote once and have it fixed. For 99% of people that is the appropriate level of engagement. You need an American Bukele, perhaps with a stiffer temperament, but instead they got Trump.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
Strongly agree on removing the bullshit. I think it's especially bad in science. I think most of the disciplines do next to no useful work because of it. If you're going to give someone the title, just give them the money and let them work on whatever they want. Fewer scientists - fine - but full freedom.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
And Slave Morality is the Master Morality of moralities, because it is clearly most effective and now people are blindly justifying it whatever the outcome because it is powerful and blindly justifying whatever is most dominant is ... Master Morality. Gee wiz that sounds like recursion.
Immediate_Bit
2mo ago
Started reading this. Didn't finish. Know what it will fall into. It's going to be one of these split the world into a dichotomy that doesn't actually map onto reality then spend thousands of words agonising over the discrepancy between the real world and the 2 variable system. There should be a name for this. Perhaps Retard's Dilemma.
Master Morality is just the more natural way of things. Bears, lions all live under master morality. So do elk. They can't co-ordinate much to create moral systems or aren't incentivised to.
Slave Morality is just the moral rules people come up with when the want to push away some of the harshness of nature. If we don't constantly compete over each others wives, and we don't steal from each other etc. etc. we can all be more successful (as a group). I don't know if group selection is involved biologically (I have heard this is controversial) - it certainly can be in culture. And cultures which punish those who break group norms will de-select those people from the gene pool. Japanese are very different to Africans.
Systems which organise people with better incentives to co-operate will outcompete those which don't. African people are much closer to Master Morality. Strong rule. You see this in black NBA players when they are close to an MVP - they will talk themselves up saying they are the best. White players do not do this. In most white cultures it is very impolite to do so. You perform and let others judge you for your performance. You don't make the judgement on yourself. Also - much of the distaste of Trump (it is distasteful once you stop laughing, but it takes a long time to stop laughing).
Obviously a society is made up of individuals and they still need to do things so you only want your moral system cutting down antisocial behaviours. Extremely boastful behaviour is like this - it creates a race to the bottom. Moral systems are basically that - what rules and enforcements are needed to avoid races to the bottom so the group (individuals in the group) can be better off. And then gaming the moral system.
We still need to show off and so negotiate rules around these behaviours, then try to break the rules, accuse other of it etc etc.
The strong want to game the system by lionizing their strength and taking what they can get away with (or are at least incentivised to) and the weak limiting their harm. All while attaching themselves to strengths they can feed off. There own strengths aren't actually fair strengths to target etc. etc.
So a starting point for negotiation is all your behaviour that doesn't benefit me is bad (can simply be you doing good stuff that makes me less competitive with you) and vice versa. Then argue, lie, and try to create a ven-diagram of what we agree on and can/are willing to enforce. Thus, morality.
It makes groups stronger so it persists. It creates genetic selection in the groups.
Immediate_Bit
3mo ago
This is tangential, but I think people underestimate the effect wireheading will play in this. For those unfamiliar, wireheading refers to experiments where rats and people have had stimulatory electrodes inserted into certain parts of their brain and sometimes, due to misplacement in people or correct placement in animals, result in completely addictatory behaviour surrounding the stimulation of the electrode.
We already have this to a large extent in drugs. Anyone with any experience with this knows its incredibly profound the extent to which "push a chemical button" (and a very crude button) changes subjective experience. Societies nearly have (or perhaps have) collapsed under this even with these crude mechanisms which are naturally opposed by evolutionary homeostatic mechanisms.
If we end up with true wireheading a lot of these concerns become redundant. Wireheading without reason is extinctatory so we may see future life as a combination of wireheading with rational self-preservation (in contrast to the self-annihilation of the heroin addict).
A lot of modern suffering is from a brain poorly adapted for modern conditions. Luxury-automated-gay-space-communism is further from the adapted environment. Our experiences with drugs have demonstrated an arbitrariness to experience you can bypass. I think you'll have to be a pretty enlightened creature to overcome the pull of this technology if (or as) it becomes available.
Once this comes online it would greatly affect what you're proposing, but hard to predict timelines.
Immediate_Bit
3mo ago
I don't think you have grounds to deport the ancestors of slaves, but you do have grounds to deport recent immigrants who were brought in under cynical circumstances or who have stronger allegiances to foreign governments/populations than they do their new nation.
You don't need to eliminate the burden. You simply need to manage its size.
I just had this thought of moving to China one day to get away from Brazil like conditions and getting bullied by Chinese for being from a retard nation that destroyed itself with immigration.
The liberalism of Jews is an interesting connection, because is it their will-to-power driving them towards the dominant ideology like other elites (in which sense they are captured) or is it because they support liberalism because it promotes Jewish interests (much easier to compete in a society as a Jew if you don't have compete with White enthnonats coordinating against you)?
I think in the Palestinian question, liberalism hurts them as they are simply another Right wing apartheid state that progressives want to crush (continue the march of Unitarianism). White enthnonats would not much care if they seized all Palestinian territory and paid them to leave (might trigger a local Middle Eastern war, I know). Conflicting incentives all round.
Immediate_Bit
3mo ago
There is a sense of victory in that, even in a troll post, people have to quite accurately reflect our views.
Immediate_Bit
3mo ago
This is correct. Jews do what Whites are culturally not allowed to do: leverage their ingroup bias to help one another in society. You can understand why they do this but this is going to make them unpopular.
Any acknowledgement of this begs the question: should Whites be doing the same? Obviously Jews don't want this and progressives don't want this understood as a (justifiable) tit-for-tat behaviour.
Mistake theory has to be rejected for high stakes because it's gameable both on a conscious and unconscious level.
I agree there is some predictive and curiosity satiating value to this kind of work but not worth the risk.
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