Gaashk
9hr ago
Is choosing a private program for pre-K not an option for you?
No, not really.
For context, I live in New Mexico, which is full of poor people and oil revenue. I had forgotten until I looked it up just now that it produces more than four times as much oil as Alaska, though still half as much as Texas. Unlike Alaska, which gives people money directly, New Mexico invests in various forms of welfare for all, so median income families qualify for pregnancy and early childhood medicaid with no fuss (I was shocked, this is worth tens of thousands of dollars per baby, and I just uploaded a couple of forms, and in the cases of the babies, the hospital uploaded the forms for me). They have a bunch of nice hispanic American ladies (many from the days when the territory literally belonged to Spain) who run nice warm daycares. All the normal daycares are now state funded (with no copay as of a year or so ago), and they have the pre-K program as an optional add-on with more curriculum, or they'll instead pay for regular daycare for four year olds, whatever the individual place decides on doing, which has also been, in my experience, fine. Finding daycare for a 1 year old and a 4 year old at the same time and the same establishment is the main impediment, which has worked out surprisingly well.
This situation has resulted in having a third child, where in another state we probably wouldn't have. As a member of the lower middle class, I like it a lot. If someone institutes low fuss UBI, it will probably be here. And it's democratic without being all that progressive, on account of all the influential people who's parents or grandparents were ranchers, so in general I like it. Also, I didn't save for a house at all, or even think of owning a house, and then a nice local organization said that, yes, we can buy a house, and just led us through exactly how to do that, then sent a non-commissioned realtor who also got up on our roof to show us how to fix the swamp cooler and stuck his hand down the food processor to fish out some broken glass that was inside.
I was more caught off guard by being called up suddenly, out of the blue.
Gaashk
9hr ago
I don't clearly remember how things went down with my previous child, but I think they suggested meeting at my house, I suggested meeting at the school, and she pretty much immediately agreed.
The program itself is voluntary, and my older daughter liked it, so I figured to do it again. They have a bit more curriculum than the regular preschool, which is also completely state funded and exists in the same building. I'm not sure how much more, actually, since the regular program is also run by a large national daycare chain and has official stations and activities. I think it's somewhat based on Head Start, which specialized in teaching poor children with parents who would give excuses about not having transportation to parent teacher conferences or something. I'm not sure about the welfare check side of things, I think it's illegal to enter a home under false pretenses, but maybe they do try to get more district resources by finding all the potential IEP kids or families who want extra services or something. The public pre-Ks here do turn some families away, but are explicitly required to accept all children with disabilities.
Perhaps I'll make the appointment. I was mostly put off by how she kept arguing with me about how extremely REQUIRED it was in an annoying and unwelcoming way, and the short notice.
Gaashk
11hr ago
I read the public message from the state program, and it does indeed say there's a mandatory home visit, though I think in this teacher's case she was not delivering the news as intended, because the material goes on about cultural responsiveness and learning about the home culture of the child and building family connections and whatnot. She offered to have me talk to her "manager," whoever that is (she is the only licensed teacher, working in a daycare that is not like that), but I said to just send me an email for now while I consult about our schedule.
I could sort of imagine why it might be a thing, but, also, it is absolutely not culturally responsive to... American culture. And I am in America.
Gaashk
11hr ago
Presumably you want your daughter in pre-k more than the teacher does. What's with the high pressure sales tactics?
I've already signed her up for the Pre-K program six months ago, and would be happy to bring her in without siblings to introduce her to the teacher. It's the local public school, not like the bespoke private ones that are trying to keep the riff-raff out, it seems to be based in some idea from the legislators that it's easier for parents and less intimidating for the child for the teacher to come to them, and with all the language around cultural responsiveness, I want to say that this is not my culture.
Haha, yeah, it sounds more like what a pastor would say about Jesus washing his disciples feet.
Gaashk
11hr ago
She just turned seven, so I think it's the age where the protocol was for me to exchange numbers with her parents, they don't do things directly yet, but also I don't want to invite her and her parents, because that gets into awkward adults failing to get to know each other while their kids come over to have something solved every five minutes, which is probably why they also didn't.
Gaashk
14hr ago
I guess that tracks with community in former Yugoslavia and the former USSR areas staying intact better.
Gaashk
14hr ago
People on here have been commenting a lot about women not showing up for dates, which does sound frustrating, but apparently they're not showing up for each other either. I was reminded of this phenomenon by this Substack post, about women preparing home cooked meals for each other in their homes, then having people not show up last second. So my initial theory that maybe young women are scared of men from outside their social circle is not the main thing going on.
One woman described her bridal shower, where a friend's grandmother prepared an elaborate celebration, but 19 guests cancelled the day of. Only one showed up. The woman said it was embarrassing and dehumanizing.
What's going on?
I tried going to a local ACX meetup, and it was fine, but after six people initially wanted to do it, only two besides myself ended up coming. Meanwhile, my daughter's pre-K teacher has invited herself to my house. She called today, and went on about a "mandatory home visit", next week, with highly inflexible weekday hours. I did not like it. She said she was going to drop off paperwork and meet my daughter. I said that I would rather bring my daughter to pick up the paperwork. We fought about it. I was perhaps more prickly than is altogether advisable when speaking to a child's teacher. I tried researching how this could be considered an appropriate thing to, not offer, not ask, but mandate. Something, something, building trust, Head Start, maybe the norms of black Americans? Clearly, they have the wrong order of things. If I trust you, I will invite you over. If I don't trust you, I will want to meet at your office. Even social workers know this. Is this related to parents not actually coming to their appointments somehow? It's juxtaposed in literature withattendance, more than understanding.
Also, meanwhile, my older daughter hasn't been invited to anyone's house. We haven't managed to invite anyone to our house. It seems terribly fraught somehow. I mostly do things with one or occasionally two other families with a stay at home mom and a mom who works two mornings a week, respectively.
Also, just because I found it odd, here's Keturah complaining about a situation where someone invited her into the hostess's home, and Keturah came, and then they judged each other for their stance on shoes, that Keturah wanted to keep them on, and the hostess wanted her to take them off.
I liked the culture of Georgians (Kartveli) and Albanians that homes are sacred, guests are from God, and that guests and hosts have important mutual roles and responsibilities.
What's the sociology here? Why are Americans like this, despite seeming deeply unhappy about it?
Gaashk
15hr ago
Should I send my kids to this weirdly intense Russian Orthodox camp? https://www.orprcamp.org (I probably won't, as we're not of Russian descent, but it looks intriguing)
Gaashk
1d ago
When I have pockets: cell phone in wallet case with ID and credit cards, small toys my children have left behind, wrapper, receipt. When I don't have pockets, I haven't been carrying a purse lately, so everything except the phone, which is in my hand, stays in the car.
My car has many and varied wonders within it, including a knife, I believe.
Gaashk
1d ago
Ah, yeah, I do think that women are still wildly outnumbered in geek subcultures, even though it's not so socially damaging as it was, mostly just what people are drawn to, I think.
I'm not sure about the political sloganeering. I don't much care for it, but also y husband and I often slide into complaining about culture war stuff from our respective message boards. My mom was always listening to conservative talk radio in the car as she drove us places (literal Rush Limbaugh), but I suppose it's a good sign if you offer your actual opinion, and she reciprocates without too much moral indignation? Almost my first conversation with my now husband was him criticizing the president of Georgia, who had made a program I joined and liked, and me being irritated about it, because I was grateful for the opportunity. I'm a bit confused by whatever current feminism is going around, but sometimes I read conversations here, or have encountered very conservative families, and have some sympathy. I'm not sure where the thoughtful centrist women are looking for men these days, unfortunately, but it seems like the where is probably the bigger question -- it doesn't seem to be on dating apps, and they're also concerned and frustrated about not having an obvious place to meet good men.
Gaashk
1d ago
I think it's important to teach the youth that knives are tools more than they're weapons, and alcohol is a social lubricant more than something to binge in private. I have a bunch of little (but very sharp!) knives in my elementary classroom I inherited from a previous teacher, and I don't let the kids use them very often, but I do want them to see adults using tools that require care to be safe. That's actually one of the art standards, learning how to use tools safely. I think it's a Scouting requirement as well.
Gaashk
3d ago
Fair. I do think most people end up having to listen to their partner complain about politics a bit, whatver their cultural constellation of political complaints happens to be. What is your preferred subculture?
Gaashk
3d ago
I've lost a lot of weight over the past six months, I'm now under 200lbs. I'm a quarter-inch shy of 6ft. I'm apparently handsome. I'm a bartender, I've done stand-up, I'm an accomplished Dungeon Master, I can hold a conversation and be charming. I dress well. A guy friend said "I don't see how you could have any problem dating, dude, look at you." I know he was trying to be encouraging, but hearing it it just crushed me inside. I get less interest from women now than I did when I weighed 240lbs. Part of this is that I just became less outgoing over the past two years, because when I would try, I'd just have experiences that made me hate people. Women would start conversations with "Men are all such trash, amirite? Such-and-such media is So Queer, so-and-so film is Incel, what are your Pronouns? Astrology, Gaza, Orange Man, there's too many white people around here, I'm neurodivergent and asexual." The other week, some woman I'd spoken to before and been shot down by came over to me at my local bar and inserted herself into me and my friends' conversation, talked over both of us, then said she was going back over there, I could come join her if I wanted to. "There" was over by the guy she had come to the bar with. I didn't take her up on it, few things disgust me more than a woman flirting with me when she's already on a date with someone else.
It sounds more like you have a regional culture problem than a dating app problem. Have you ever considered moving to someplace where the women like fishing, camping, and complaining about abortion?
Gaashk
3d ago
This pitch would go over a lot better if you were to focus on girls, rather than women, and in more of a family and school context, rather than a romantic context. While it's true that an anxious and depressed girl is going to have all kinds of romantic trouble, focusing on that from the perspective of the man who would have liked to have dated her but now can't is way less socially acceptable. You can say they shouldn't be, but you're not going to change centuries of social programming, it's not a fence that's worth removing.
People actually are worried about the girls, and a lot of the negative affects set in in adolescence, especially among teenage girls. People like Abigail Shrier and Johnathan Haidt talk about that a lot, and there isn't all that much pushback about Haidt being a man, since forming young minds has been his area of interest for decades, and now he's interested in these depressed teenage girls; makes sense.
Gaashk
4d ago
Perhaps you could clarify that you're a hardcore pacifist, and that it would have been wrong to murder Hitler as well?
Gaashk
4d ago
I know and have known a decent number of trad women. They're basically OK with "husband makes the final decision".
Focusing on controlling appearance is weird, though, since traditionally the woman manages not only her own appearance, but that of the children, and to some extent her husband and interior design as well. She is also forming the aesthetic judgement of the children. So it's best not to marry a woman with very poor taste.
Gaashk
4d ago
Lol. Controlling the internet settings is a more reasonable and trad position than controlling your wife's fashion choices, anyway.
Gaashk
4d ago
I'm doubting the premise that 1) a woman in a happy relationship would disfigure herself in ways she knew would piss off her husband, or 2) if she did, whether him going on about Authority and Correctness and the he's got to corral her behavior, would do anything except make the situation worse.
Do you know many conservative women? The main danger is that they'll start wearing frumpy t-shirt dresses and let all their makeup expire, such that it become very difficult for them to dress up nicely, which is what I thought your initial comment was pointing to. If they're going full midlife crisis, I don't know what the solution is in that case, probably a change of social group. Perhaps an internet free religious retreat?
Gaashk
5d ago
The reason it comes across as weirdly controlling is that women in happy relationships don't suddenly dye their hair and get a new tattoo that they know their husband will hate. That's already a sign that the relationship is on the rocks, without any control rhetoric. This is true of most things (getting fat less so, especially after some children). If you say "wow, those huge pants that are trending sure are ugly!" And she goes out and buys the ugly pants you hate, that is already a sign that she doesn't respect you. That's less the case with things like getting fat and cutting her hair after bearing your children, because small children really do like pulling hair with surprising intensity, and all things cooking and exercise related can become harder.
Gaashk
5d ago
Exactly. So it should be even easier for them to stay home.
That is not necessarily true. "Easier" can mean different things. Idle hands are the devil's workshop and whatnot. Suppose you've got a mother of three children, they are a baby, a three year old, and a five year old. In a traditional household, there would be washing day, when she and her neighbors go down to the stream to wash, you all bring your children, and the children splash around in the stream. You would have pastry making day, when your sister brings her kids over, they kick a ball around the street, and you make pastry together. You spend a lot of time making clothes, and your older daughter is gradually also learning to sew, and the younger kids are out watching some other kids kick a ball around.
(This was not true of the American West, but the Dustbowl West sounded like a uniquely nightmarish place to raise children)
Now, you can still invite your friend and her children to the stream, but you're just sitting around watching the children. You can still make pastry together, but you realize this is a bit futile, because the pastry at the store is both better and cheaper, and the children cannot kick the ball around the street, there are cars, and no other kids their age. You can sew with your daughter, but it's just a hobby, and mostly for cosplay. And so on. Armenians have Rug Beating Week, when they air out and beat their rugs, all at the same time. You're replacing a communal activity with having to make up activities to avoid boredom, which feels quite different.
Gaashk
5d ago
That part stood out to me as well. I couldn't imagine what it even meant. Sure, he could divorce her is she got too fat or something, I guess, but otherwise I'm simply confused.
Gaashk
5d ago
I miss cooking for one. I could make something nutritious but not amazing, like lentil and onion stew, and I would eat it for two meals, and it would be fine. Now I get to say things like "you can't have a snack because you didn't eat your mashed potatoes and fried chicken strips!"
Gaashk
7d ago
Sure, kids should be able to go places alone a bit more. That wouldn't affect my own neighborhood all that much, but would be an improvement on the margin.
Yeah, I've heard that. I've heard it about parts of Chicago as well, and in both places, I don't drive with the windows down or leave my car for large stretches of time or walk alone, and so on.
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